#128383 - RikuDawn - Fri May 11, 2007 2:29 am
I think an N64 emulator for DS would be awesome. I wouldn't really care what it's like as long as it would work. It could be like a port of 1964 or Project 64 on DS. Or just a completly different thing. Or could you at least convert certain N64 roms to run on the DS without an emulator?
#128384 - chuckstudios - Fri May 11, 2007 2:57 am
No.
#128385 - dualscreenman - Fri May 11, 2007 3:13 am
_________________
| dualscreenman wrote: |
| What about Gaim DS? Gaim pretty much has support for all IM programs. |
| tepples wrote: |
| "Goshdammit, the DS is not a Gaim-boy! It's a third pillar!" |
#128390 - DragonMinded - Fri May 11, 2007 4:24 am
_________________
Enter the mind of the dragon.
http://dragonminded.blogspot.com
Seriously guys, how hard is it to simply TRY something yourself?
#128392 - six-five-two - Fri May 11, 2007 4:49 am
#128394 - Dood77 - Fri May 11, 2007 5:01 am
#128397 - Tockit - Fri May 11, 2007 5:45 am
hah! I just want everyone to know how much I enjoyed reading this thread.
top to bottom.
_________________
-01011101001010101010 (frank)
#128399 - DragonMinded - Fri May 11, 2007 6:04 am
c-c-c-c-combo breaker!
_________________
Enter the mind of the dragon.
http://dragonminded.blogspot.com
Seriously guys, how hard is it to simply TRY something yourself?
#128402 - dantheman - Fri May 11, 2007 6:11 am
| DragonMinded wrote: |
| c-c-c-c-combo breaker! |
Darnit, you stole my line 5 minutes before I was going to post. Curse you... >_>
But yeah, seriously, the answer is no.
#128404 - six-five-two - Fri May 11, 2007 6:23 am
| DragonMinded wrote: |
| c-c-c-c-combo breaker! |
#128408 - OOPMan - Fri May 11, 2007 7:42 am
| six-five-two wrote: |
| DragonMinded wrote: | | c-c-c-c-combo breaker! |
|
_________________
"My boot, your face..." - Attributed to OOPMan, Emperor of Eroticon VI
You can find my NDS homebrew projects here...
#128412 - Miika - Fri May 11, 2007 8:55 am
Hell. No. How hard can it be to understand? NO! I will NEVER happen!
I hate people like this... stupidity.
_________________
My DSQuake video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03wz7nmaXa8
My QuakeDS video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNIKneo11o4
#128415 - simonjhall - Fri May 11, 2007 9:14 am
Ok, I'm gonna go against the flow here and give a yes - seriously!
It'd NEVER be playable, but it's not technically impossible to do on the DS, and I think that warrants just having a go. I actually considered doing this a while ago, but I ended up writing some other game instead...
Again to clarify, performance would be *shite* but that wouldn't matter to me.
_________________
Big thanks to everyone who donated for Quake2
#128422 - silent_code - Fri May 11, 2007 11:32 am
simon, what about memory? both systems have only 4mb and the emulator would need some. that means it had to be either small and games that do not need the whole memory could run or one had to use some ram pak.
you are right, it would go to some extend, but wouldn't be anything worth playing.
and why do ppl thing they are the first person in the world to think of that, when the system is about three years old and the forum is even older!? i don't get it! i hope anybody getting that "fantastic" idea (without having a slight technical understanding of any of the systems) will first *search* the forum before posting. i'm getting bored of this. i know, i can ignore it, but... geez, whatever.
ps: voted no.
#128428 - dualscreenman - Fri May 11, 2007 12:19 pm
| simonjhall wrote: |
Ok, I'm gonna go against the flow here and give a yes - seriously!
It'd NEVER be playable, but it's not technically impossible to do on the DS, and I think that warrants just having a go. I actually considered doing this a while ago, but I ended up writing some other game instead...
Again to clarify, performance would be *shite* but that wouldn't matter to me. |
I'd rather you try Quake 4 first. :P
_________________
| dualscreenman wrote: |
| What about Gaim DS? Gaim pretty much has support for all IM programs. |
| tepples wrote: |
| "Goshdammit, the DS is not a Gaim-boy! It's a third pillar!" |
#128435 - tepples - Fri May 11, 2007 1:11 pm
| RikuDawn wrote: |
| I think an N64 emulator for DS would be awesome. I wouldn't really care what it's like as long as it would work. It could be like a port of 1964 or Project 64 on DS. |
DS has a 67 MHz CPU. What CPU speed is needed to run 1964 or Project 64?
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#128440 - simonjhall - Fri May 11, 2007 1:59 pm
| silent_code wrote: |
| simon, what about memory? |
Sorry yeah, I meant to say with a Supercard plugged in slot-2.
| Quote: |
| I'd rather you try Quake 4 first. :P |
It's a damn shame that they haven't released the source to that yet. A damn shame :-D
_________________
Big thanks to everyone who donated for Quake2
#128442 - Gendo Ikari - Fri May 11, 2007 2:33 pm
The main N64 CPU is about 100 Mhz fast.
The N64 co-processor, the RCP, is about 70 Mhz fast.
So run a playable N64 emulator on NDS is impossible.
#128449 - Lynx - Fri May 11, 2007 4:16 pm
| simonjhall wrote: |
| Quote: | | I'd rather you try Quake 4 first. :P |
It's a damn shame that they haven't released the source to that yet. A damn shame :-D |
What? Can't you just make a converter so that it will run on the DS?
[/sarcasm]
_________________
NDS Homebrew Roms & Reviews
#128451 - simonjhall - Fri May 11, 2007 5:05 pm
Good idea!
Make a thread about this 'awesom3 idea' of yours :-D
_________________
Big thanks to everyone who donated for Quake2
#128463 - Darkflame - Fri May 11, 2007 6:07 pm
I think an N64<<>>DS rom convertor would be (marginaly) more likely.
Or a (wireframe) N64 emulator that runes at 5fps :p
_________________
Darkflames Reviews --
Make your own at;
Rateoholic:Reviews for anything, by anyone.
#128468 - Gunnex - Fri May 11, 2007 7:26 pm
| Darkflame wrote: |
I think an N64<<>>DS rom convertor would be (marginaly) more likely.
Or a (wireframe) N64 emulator that runes at 5fps :p |
Converter? Feh, that would mean tearing apart the source code and re-writing it to work on a DS at a lower speed.
I don't know why everyone thinks a ROM can be 'converted'
#128471 - six-five-two - Fri May 11, 2007 8:35 pm
I now think it kinda is possible... except for the fact it will be rrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllllllllllllllllllllllllyyyyyyyyyyyyy ssssssllllllllloooooooooooowwwwwwwwww.
#128475 - Rajveer - Fri May 11, 2007 8:57 pm
No sarcasm, I really think it's possible.
...If we don't emulate the graphics/audio chip (if that)...
#128478 - Miika - Fri May 11, 2007 9:40 pm
Without audio or textures and a game that needs 1-2 mb of memory hmmm maybe 1 frame per 10 seconds. If we are lucky. Would be damn good proof of concept :P
_________________
My DSQuake video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03wz7nmaXa8
My QuakeDS video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNIKneo11o4
#128480 - Lynx - Fri May 11, 2007 9:55 pm
Anything is possible.. but that doesn't mean it will be usable. GPF ported an Atari Lynx emulator for me and it worked.. just wasn't playable.
_________________
NDS Homebrew Roms & Reviews
#128486 - dantheman - Fri May 11, 2007 10:48 pm
True, it is possible. Heck, FluBBA made a WonderSwan emulator for the GBA, though it ran at about 1.5 fps, and there was an NES emulator for the GBC that didn't run much faster (though it did have sound!). Possible, yes, playable, no.
#128488 - jester - Fri May 11, 2007 10:50 pm
exactly unless you can deal with the "thing" working at slow fps levels.
_________________
If anyone needs a dragonball online email me @ aaronthejester@hotmail.com
#128502 - tondopie - Sat May 12, 2007 12:41 am
hey jester, wasn't there all ready a topic ABOUT this at Moddz?
-Max
_________________
Development Blog: http://teendev.org
Homebrew Podcast: http://homebrewcast.net
Web Design: http://xtendesign.net
#128504 - six-five-two - Sat May 12, 2007 1:51 am
If you can emulate N64 on DS it would be WAY slower than Daedalus, the N64 emulator for PSP. Even that is slow:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=9lXwUFGeKHE
And no, it isn't the video that is slow, it is the emulator itself. Check out the other videos and see.
#128594 - OSW - Sun May 13, 2007 7:19 am
| OOPMan wrote: |
| six-five-two wrote: | | DragonMinded wrote: | | c-c-c-c-combo breaker! |
|
|
#128669 - Dood77 - Sun May 13, 2007 11:55 pm
| six-five-two wrote: |
If you can emulate N64 on DS it would be WAY slower than Daedalus, the N64 emulator for PSP. Even that is slow:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=9lXwUFGeKHE
And no, it isn't the video that is slow, it is the emulator itself. Check out the other videos and see. |
Actually, Daedalus on PSP is a port of the PC Daedalus. Also the version in that video is r8, when r11 is the most recent I believe...
But yeah, more likely would be something that converted the roms and downsized the textures and broke the DS's RSA encryption and revealed all of Nintendo's source codes and made hell freeze over.
Hey, it could happen!
Last edited by Dood77 on Mon May 14, 2007 11:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
#128680 - PhoenixSoft - Mon May 14, 2007 1:15 am
Is it possible to set up an autoban system for people who post threads with the string "N64 Emulator" in the title?
That would make things more fun.
EDIT: But there may be a chance when the DS successor is released. Nintendo should be getting ready to announce it soon:
Game Boy Color: 1998
*3 years*
Game Boy Advance: 2001
*3 years*
Nintendo DS: 2004
*3 years*
NTR2: 2007?
Although I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo delay it another couple of years until the DS Lite sales dip.
Last edited by PhoenixSoft on Mon May 14, 2007 1:22 am; edited 1 time in total
#128681 - tondopie - Mon May 14, 2007 1:18 am
| PhoenixSoft wrote: |
Is it possible to set up an autoban system for people who post threads with the string "N64 Emulator" in the title?
That would make things more fun. |
PHBB(2) isn't that powerful.
Back on topic, Haven't we already established that the DS is incapiable of running N64 games?
-TOPIC LOCKED- lol
_________________
Development Blog: http://teendev.org
Homebrew Podcast: http://homebrewcast.net
Web Design: http://xtendesign.net
#128683 - dantheman - Mon May 14, 2007 1:33 am
| tondopie wrote: |
| -TOPIC LOCKED- lol |
That doesn't work here, it doesn't work on any other forum, and it makes you look like a fool. If the original topic creator or a mod wishes to close the thread, then that's fine. Until then, we're still allowed to talk about the topic, aren't we?
#128684 - tondopie - Mon May 14, 2007 1:34 am
I know Im just haven some fun anyway.....
If the prossessors were fast enough where would we get enough RAM?
_________________
Development Blog: http://teendev.org
Homebrew Podcast: http://homebrewcast.net
Web Design: http://xtendesign.net
#128685 - tepples - Mon May 14, 2007 1:41 am
| tondopie wrote: |
| If the prossessors were fast enough where would we get enough RAM? |
Opera comes out in June.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#128687 - tondopie - Mon May 14, 2007 1:47 am
I imported it and It only contains 8 MB of RAM... the N64 needs more for most games I think...
_________________
Development Blog: http://teendev.org
Homebrew Podcast: http://homebrewcast.net
Web Design: http://xtendesign.net
#128693 - Ant6n - Mon May 14, 2007 2:44 am
has anybody ever managed to disassemble MIPS and reassemble to ARM?
#128709 - dualscreenman - Mon May 14, 2007 1:00 pm
| tondopie wrote: |
| I imported it and It only contains 8 MB of RAM... the N64 needs more for most games I think... |
Only if they need the expansion pack.
The N64 had 4 MiB of RAM unless you had the expansion pack.
_________________
| dualscreenman wrote: |
| What about Gaim DS? Gaim pretty much has support for all IM programs. |
| tepples wrote: |
| "Goshdammit, the DS is not a Gaim-boy! It's a third pillar!" |
#128714 - pas - Mon May 14, 2007 2:08 pm
overclock the ds then write an emu for this (just joking...)
_________________
Starcraft DS ?
#128720 - OOPMan - Mon May 14, 2007 3:07 pm
| Ant6n wrote: |
| has anybody ever managed to disassemble MIPS and reassemble to ARM? |
Somehow I doubt the answer is yes...
_________________
"My boot, your face..." - Attributed to OOPMan, Emperor of Eroticon VI
You can find my NDS homebrew projects here...
#128723 - dualscreenman - Mon May 14, 2007 3:24 pm
^I lol'd.
_________________
| dualscreenman wrote: |
| What about Gaim DS? Gaim pretty much has support for all IM programs. |
| tepples wrote: |
| "Goshdammit, the DS is not a Gaim-boy! It's a third pillar!" |
#128731 - Miika - Mon May 14, 2007 5:29 pm
Well you could do that mod that makes the NDS run 1.7x speed :P No it would suck anyway.
_________________
My DSQuake video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03wz7nmaXa8
My QuakeDS video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNIKneo11o4
#128745 - tepples - Mon May 14, 2007 7:01 pm
| dualscreenman wrote: |
| tondopie wrote: | | I imported it and It only contains 8 MB of RAM... the N64 needs more for most games I think... |
Only if they need the expansion pack.
The N64 had 4 MiB of RAM unless you had the expansion pack. |
But it also had a huge word-addressed memory using a seek/read protocol much like that of GBA ROM. A DS running from SLOT-1 doesn't have this.
My recommendation: Get SNEmulDS running at full speed for all games, then get Super FX and SA-1 emulation into SNEmulDS, then worry about Nintendo 64.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#128759 - Darkflame - Mon May 14, 2007 10:29 pm
| PhoenixSoft wrote: |
Is it possible to set up an autoban system for people who post threads with the string "N64 Emulator" in the title?
That would make things more fun.
EDIT: But there may be a chance when the DS successor is released. Nintendo should be getting ready to announce it soon:
Game Boy Color: 1998
*3 years*
Game Boy Advance: 2001
*3 years*
Nintendo DS: 2004
*3 years*
NTR2: 2007?
Although I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo delay it another couple of years until the DS Lite sales dip. |
hmz..I wouldn't call the Gameboy Color a proper step up though, kinda a half step as most games were dual-format with the GB.
I think the DS is emulating the success of the original Gameboy, and we wont see any real improvement for quite some time.
A few revisions maybe, but a new system is two years away at least, possibly longer.
_________________
Darkflames Reviews --
Make your own at;
Rateoholic:Reviews for anything, by anyone.
#128761 - Lynx - Mon May 14, 2007 10:51 pm
Well, you already have the DS-Lite.. so that buys another 3 years.. :)
_________________
NDS Homebrew Roms & Reviews
#128781 - chishm - Tue May 15, 2007 6:45 am
| Lynx wrote: |
| Well, you already have the DS-Lite.. so that buys another 3 years.. :) |
Ah, but the DS Lite is to the DS as the GBA SP is to the GBA. That is, the improvements make no difference to the actual code running on them.
_________________
http://chishm.drunkencoders.com
http://dldi.drunkencoders.com
#128792 - mml - Tue May 15, 2007 10:15 am
I think that was his point? -- that they've committed a major hardware revision to the same API, so that API is going to hang around for at least the useful lifetime of the new hardware.
#128793 - chishm - Tue May 15, 2007 10:32 am
My point is they did the exact same thing with the GBA and GBA SP, and the total time between release of the original GBA and the DS was around 3.5-4 years. So we should be expecting a new handheld in about a year.
_________________
http://chishm.drunkencoders.com
http://dldi.drunkencoders.com
#128794 - OOPMan - Tue May 15, 2007 10:40 am
Nah, I doubt it. Maybe 2 years...
_________________
"My boot, your face..." - Attributed to OOPMan, Emperor of Eroticon VI
You can find my NDS homebrew projects here...
#128805 - tepples - Tue May 15, 2007 12:47 pm
DS came out early (only 3.5 years into GBA lifetime) for two reasons:
- The GameCube wasn't selling so well. Wii, on the other hand, appears ready to surpass the GameCube console's total sales in its first two years even if Nintendo can't step up production.
- At the time, Sony was threatening to launch the PSP. So don't expect more capable hardware from Nintendo until Microsoft tries to market a handheld gaming device or Sony announces another PSP.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#128821 - Lynx - Tue May 15, 2007 5:03 pm
Or they can at least catch up on Wii production so things will settle down and they can concentrate on development.
I can't imagine what production managers are going through right now.
_________________
NDS Homebrew Roms & Reviews
#128824 - Dood77 - Tue May 15, 2007 6:25 pm
Even if Nintendo released the DS in a normal cycle (not influenced by failing sales etc.) I think they would hold back the next model because the DS sales are still soaring.
#128837 - Darkflame - Tue May 15, 2007 8:48 pm
Yes, they delayed some of the other models due to success of previous ones too.
I think the next portable system wont be for awhile.
And a good thing too!
Lets them make it a BIG step up.
Personaly, I'm hoping for a built in camera which can be used for gyroscopic motion sensing and Augmented Reality feature.
Basicaly, A Gizmondo,but done right ;)
Another nice thing;
By the time the next portable comes from Nintendo, solid state will be crazy cheap.
1GB SD card on amazon is currently ?3
Now, obviously the price crash its going to fall off a bit, but I fully expect 8GB game capacity on solid state SD-like cards being possible in 2-3 years.
_________________
Darkflames Reviews --
Make your own at;
Rateoholic:Reviews for anything, by anyone.
#128845 - TOAST - Tue May 15, 2007 9:49 pm
Seeing as the good games already have been ported (/been made a better follower up for the DS) it would be of pretty much no use unless you could play multiplayer via wifi (SSB!!!).
#128851 - Dood77 - Tue May 15, 2007 10:53 pm
Sort of a side topic... I always wonder why Nintendo doesn't transfer some of their most successful franchises over to portable systems? For instance mario party on GBA, I believe this was released at the time when Mario Party 6 was new? I never played it much but I heard it was a far cry from the console Mario Party games. And I don't think they did anything with GC to GBA connectivity either.
So Nintendo tears down all these homebrew SSB projects, but we don't even have any corporate-based rumors that there is even an official english version of Jump! Superstars coming across the pacific.
Also kinda like Paper Mario and Mario and Luigi. I'm wondering why Nintendo didn't keep the franchise name, and therefore made a whole different game, not to mention I'm sure lots more people would have paid attention if they saw the title of Paper Mario on GBA. (Not to mention Mario and Luigi wasn't even developed by nintendo...)
I can only think of a few modern handheld<>console franchises... excluding classic remakes and such. Mario Tennis and Golf both had GBC versions, but the newer Strikers and Baseball don't even have any handheld spinoffs. Oh, just remembered about Animal Crossing (good think I did, or tepples would be correcting...)
I can see reasons for not porting some stuff. Look at the PSP, Sony was pushing the "Hand-held Console" idea, and now look where it sits. But a game like SSB, or even a classic n64 SSB port would sell phenomenally on the DS. Heck, just get Hal to do it, Nintendo's fully involved in Brawl, I guess you can use that excuse...
So I guess I'm done ranting...
_________________
If I use a term wrong or something then feel free to correct, I?m not much of a programmer.
Original DS Phat obtained on day of release + flashme v7
Supercard: miniSD, Kingston 1GB, Kingston 2GB
Ralink chipset PCI NIC
#128911 - silent_code - Wed May 16, 2007 6:36 pm
guys, i'd really like to play my gamecube games on a handheld. the psp being a derivate of the ps2, i guess big n could do that with the good old gc, too. but it's just me ranting...
back on topic (note: flaming ahead): those of you, who'd ever heard of the infamous RSP (n64's "reality signal processor" / aka the co-processor) and it's "microcode straight ot of hell" know this would require multiple nds'es to emulate in realtime. speaking of just that one chip.
so kiddies, please: cut the crap and better do your homework!
if it's ever going to happen you'll be pissed off by the performace anyway. i can practically hear stuff like "that n64 nds emulator is <woops, bad word>! it is a like it runs with 0 frames per second or something! who would, like, even want that!?". oh, how that makes me sick already!
ps: there should be a sticky thread saying "NO IT'S NOT POSSIBLE TO MAKE AN ENJOYABLE N64 EMULATOR FOR THE NDS (NO, NOT EVEN FOR THE GODDAMN NDS *LITE*)! ... AND IT'S DEFINITELY NOT POSSIBLE TO *CONVERT* (GOD! LIGHTNING - MAKE LIGHTNING STRIKE THEM DOWN!) ROMS! SO, PLEASE STOP BOTHERING AND ANNOYING FORUM MEMBERS WITH YOUR OH-SO GREAT IDEA (THAT ONLY *YOU* - OUT OF >6 BILLION PEOPLE AROUND THE WORLD - HAD)!"
ok, there's not enough topic space for that, but at least i'm back on the "calm side of life" again. ;^)
pps: there really should be such an autobanner like on the facepunch studios' forum. the sole purpose of it would be to act as the lightning i wished so hard (s.a.). "n64" + "emulator" = <ka-woom!>
#128915 - Lynx - Wed May 16, 2007 7:08 pm
Soooo... What are you trying to say?
_________________
NDS Homebrew Roms & Reviews
#128927 - silent_code - Wed May 16, 2007 7:50 pm
what i said before: no. ;^D and "this topic is getting old". don't think it is hard to understand.
i hope i didn't offend you in any way.
ps: i might also add that i, too, don't expect another nintendo handheld sometime very soon. at least not long before the next home console cycle, as the nds goes along with the wii. just like the gba and the gc or the gb(c) and the snes/n64 (oh, oh! two generations of the same gameboy adapter? at least the n64 wide boy wasn't official. but there was a way to link n64 and gb pok?mon games via a controller pak or something). but that's offtopic.
pps: (i often write in parentheses, sorry about that).
#128945 - simonjhall - Wed May 16, 2007 11:41 pm
Yeah I gotta agree, this N64 lark is dragging on a bit.
The only way I can think of doing full speed N64 on the DS is (here we go...) for you to emulate it on the PC and then pipe the results to the DS ;-D
But seriously, it's a no-no.
I don't think it's not emulatable though - but just not at real-time rates. And I'm still thinking about whopping out an emulator port just to make the point, once and for all.
Teh pwn.
_________________
Big thanks to everyone who donated for Quake2
#128948 - Darkflame - Thu May 17, 2007 12:05 am
Would be funny to have an N64 emulator that works at something like 1 frame every 10 seconds :p
| Quote: |
| AND IT'S DEFINITELY NOT POSSIBLE TO *CONVERT* (GOD! LIGHTNING - MAKE LIGHTNING STRIKE THEM DOWN!) ROMS |
Id still say its more possible to convert a rom then emulate.
But Im just nit-picking here what "possible" means.
I think converting a rom would be infinitely hard, but at least it doesn't have the actually impossible physical restrictions of the difference in hardware.
On a more realistic note, maybe you could at least reduce all the textures in the Rom's down to make emulation at a ridiculously low rate a fraction more possible.
_________________
Darkflames Reviews --
Make your own at;
Rateoholic:Reviews for anything, by anyone.
#128950 - simonjhall - Thu May 17, 2007 12:20 am
Converting a rom would be a bit like using an emulator which uses dynamic recompilation. It'd still be as slow as ants, but not as slow as the most naive emulator. You do get cool problems with fancy stuff, such as self-modifying code though.
_________________
Big thanks to everyone who donated for Quake2
#128970 - Ant6n - Thu May 17, 2007 6:54 am
does anybody have like a gbatec style version for the N64?
how much selfmodifying code is there going to be on a console, estimations?
#128995 - silent_code - Thu May 17, 2007 12:49 pm
| Darkflame wrote: |
Id still say its more possible to convert a rom then emulate.
But Im just nit-picking here what "possible" means.
I think converting a rom would be infinitely hard, but at least it doesn't have the actually impossible physical restrictions of the difference in hardware. |
well, what i mean by "not possible" is that you would have to recode so much of a game, that you'd eventually end up just using the art assets and virtually none of the unmodified code. do that for one or two games and you're done with it, to never touch that subject again. it's a lot of work (i guess porting over quake can be consideres first grade compared to such a task) because the hardware designs are so differnt.
| Darkflame wrote: |
| On a more realistic note, maybe you could at least reduce all the textures in the Rom's down to make emulation at a ridiculously low rate a fraction more possible. |
<lol> actually nds games have higher resolution textures than the n64! the n64 has only a 4kbyte texture buffer. that's like 2 64x64x4bit textures. the nds is overall more powerful than the n64, imo.
the point of my statement was that those ppl who're *demanding* n64 emulation would not use such an emulator if it wasn't playable. so besides a proof of concept (i really encourage that! in a technical and intellectual way, though.) i don't see much sense of such a project. besides just posting a link to a "working" emulator whenever someone asks the ever same question. thinking of the bitter disappointment such a person would have makes me smile. ;^D
if you find such a document, please feel free to share it with us!
#129014 - Darkflame - Thu May 17, 2007 7:38 pm
| Quote: |
| <lol> actually nds games have higher resolution textures than the n64! the n64 has only a 4kbyte texture buffer. that's like 2 64x64x4bit textures. the nds is overall more powerful than the n64, imo. |
oh, sure, the DS is a lot more powerfull, imo. (Mario64 on the DS is clearly suppiour graphicaly, as is Metroid Hunters compared to say, Golden Eye).
However, with any emulator running you got the ram restrictions due to whatever the (probably large) emulator will take.
_________________
Darkflames Reviews --
Make your own at;
Rateoholic:Reviews for anything, by anyone.
#129016 - pas - Thu May 17, 2007 9:27 pm
about that recode N64 Games for the DS theory, wouldn't a sourcecode be required to do so ?
BTW: Simonjhall, I want to see that 1fps proof of concept, mind making it ?
_________________
Starcraft DS ?
#129017 - simonjhall - Thu May 17, 2007 9:54 pm
Having source would definately be the best way to do it. If you don't have source you may as well get an emulator. 'Converting a ROM' is basically the poor-man's version of an emulator which uses dynarec.
Y'see I would actually have a go. However the amount of work that would be required to get something which is NEVER gonna run at real-time framerates is just pointless! If there wasn't that 8-bit hoo-ha with extended memory on the gba bus I'd do it...
I still think a gba emulator would be much more interesting, but also pointless as I have a few slot-2 flash cards :-D
Either way, you KNOW that as soon as one N64 emulator is announced three other ones are gonna spring up at the same time!
_________________
Big thanks to everyone who donated for Quake2
#129035 - Dood77 - Fri May 18, 2007 5:34 am
| simonjhall wrote: |
| Having source would definately be the best way to do it. |
What do you think Nintendo did with Super Mario 64 DS?
| simonjhall wrote: |
| Either way, you KNOW that as soon as one N64 emulator is announced three other ones are gonna spring up at the same time! |
Wait... you're saying you haven't heard of okiwifleo-64??
#129043 - GizmoTheGreen - Fri May 18, 2007 11:33 am
lol dood!
haha, you havent heard of the gnirfgba?
_________________
Starter of the project TrueLoveDS :D
Will you find True Love?
#129056 - silent_code - Fri May 18, 2007 4:30 pm
linky, linky guys! perhaps it's due to him working on quake 1/2 and stuff, you know. ;^)
and what did nintendo do with mario 64? i mean it's *their* game, they for sure *do* have all sources... so what?
you can still disassemble and use a 5-year-old autistic boy to read the code and convert it to a higher language... pointless. but you *can* replace certain portions of executable code (that's how cracking works) that you have reverse engeneered and make it run that way. although you'd have a sh?tload of work to do.
and really, reducing those n64 textures is next to removing them. you better cut out all the next to nonexistent audio, that'll save much more memory. at least all allocation/loading (and freeing) and playback instructions.
but i'm starting to jabber again. nevermind.
#129075 - Dood77 - Fri May 18, 2007 6:27 pm
| silent_code wrote: |
| and what did nintendo do with mario 64? i mean it's *their* game, they for sure *do* have all sources... so what? |
That was my point, Simon said that the best thing would be to have the original game's source, I pointed out thats how Nintendo did it :P
But then, of course, it wouldn't be emulation.
#129078 - silent_code - Fri May 18, 2007 6:33 pm
taking back the (badly crippled) sarcasm. ;^)
#129134 - Darkflame - Sat May 19, 2007 2:04 pm
| Quote: |
| Y'see I would actually have a go. However the amount of work that would be required to get something which is NEVER gonna run at real-time framerates is just pointless! |
What? so no PS1 emulator either?!
You spoil-sport.
_________________
Darkflames Reviews --
Make your own at;
Rateoholic:Reviews for anything, by anyone.
#129146 - Ant6n - Sat May 19, 2007 5:24 pm
| Quote: |
| What? so no PS1 emulator either?! |
wait, you havent heard of DSOne?
the ps1 has 'only' 30 MHz, but some geometry chip and some decompression chip it can output tons of crappy looking 'texture mapped' polygons.
But again, how/where do people find the specs for emulators?
#129150 - Darkflame - Sat May 19, 2007 7:10 pm
A texture-less ps1 emulator would be fun, however.
Making all the games look like Damocles :D
heck, forget it, now I want a working Amiga/Commadore emulator able to play all the Mercenary:Escape from targ games at full speed.
_________________
Darkflames Reviews --
Make your own at;
Rateoholic:Reviews for anything, by anyone.
#129155 - Miika - Sat May 19, 2007 8:34 pm
| Darkflame wrote: |
A texture-less ps1 emulator would be fun, however.
Making all the games look like Damocles :D
heck, forget it, now I want a working Amiga/Commadore emulator able to play all the Mercenary:Escape from targ games at full speed. |
Amiga / CommAdore? lol.
There is a Commodore 64 emulator, FrodoDS.
Amiga would be veeeeery slow, not even playable I guess, and would look crap.
_________________
My DSQuake video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03wz7nmaXa8
My QuakeDS video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNIKneo11o4
#129161 - Dood77 - Sun May 20, 2007 12:03 am
I'm thinking emulating the Amiga would be slightly faster than emulating DOS... which would be pretty slow.
But heck, I think I'd rather have ad-hoc wifi multiplayer for nesDS (not to mention full compatibility and DLDI...) then have a working N64 emulator.
Why you ask? There are more games I enjoy playing for longer periods of time on the NES, the DS doesn't have enough buttons to do some games justice, and I'm pretty sure if an N64 emulator showed up Nintendo would crack down harder than they ever have before.
So on the part of nesDS multiplayer... Has anyone done the PocketNES multiplayer with a link cable? Is there any latency? Does it correct the latency (do the games get out of sync with each other)? I know even between my PC wired to my router and my laptop using wireless, that Kaillera for Gens gets out of sync...
EDIT: hmm... now that I think of it... was it because I was in UDP and not TCP/IP?
#129208 - Darkflame - Sun May 20, 2007 6:09 pm
| Miika wrote: |
| Darkflame wrote: | A texture-less ps1 emulator would be fun, however.
Making all the games look like Damocles :D
heck, forget it, now I want a working Amiga/Commadore emulator able to play all the Mercenary:Escape from targ games at full speed. |
Amiga / CommAdore? lol.
There is a Commodore 64 emulator, FrodoDS.
Amiga would be veeeeery slow, not even playable I guess, and would look crap. |
Frodo is better then nothing, but its also incredibly slow.
Why's Commadores and Amigas so hard anyway?
The chips are different, but they have hardly any ram and incredibly slow clockspeeds :-/
_________________
Darkflames Reviews --
Make your own at;
Rateoholic:Reviews for anything, by anyone.
#129219 - tepples - Sun May 20, 2007 6:52 pm
Computer emulators can be slow for four reasons: - For one thing, the Amiga had an advanced GPU for its time.
- Demos and games often depend on not exactly well-known cycle-level behavior of the various components in the system.
- It takes a lot of CPU cycles to scale 320x200 pixels down to 256x192 pixels without destroying image quality.
- To save time, people port the cross-platform C version instead of rewriting things in purpose-optimized C or assembly language to allow assumptions about the DS hardware to improve performance.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#129231 - Miika - Sun May 20, 2007 8:49 pm
| tepples wrote: |
Computer emulators can be slow for four reasons: - For one thing, the Amiga had an advanced GPU for its time.
- Demos and games often depend on not exactly well-known cycle-level behavior of the various components in the system.
- It takes a lot of CPU cycles to scale 320x200 pixels down to 256x192 pixels without destroying image quality.
- To save time, people port the cross-platform C version instead of rewriting things in purpose-optimized C or assembly language to allow assumptions about the DS hardware to improve performance.
|
Not to mention a very advanced sound chip for it's time. On the GP2X Amiga emulator, the speed increases incredibly if you turn off the sound emulation. It's not just 320x200, the workbench and some others use a resolution of 640x480. No way a good amiga emulator can be made for DS, as it doesn't run fullspeed even on a GP2X! It is still quite good though.
_________________
My DSQuake video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03wz7nmaXa8
My QuakeDS video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNIKneo11o4
#129295 - NeX - Mon May 21, 2007 6:11 pm
Surely it's possible to use the 3D hardware to get around this!?
#129302 - tepples - Mon May 21, 2007 7:08 pm
No. The 3D hardware of the Nintendo DS does not use texture filtering. Instead, it just skips texels.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#129303 - Miika - Mon May 21, 2007 7:08 pm
| NeX wrote: |
| Surely it's possible to use the 3D hardware to get around this!? |
No.
_________________
My DSQuake video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03wz7nmaXa8
My QuakeDS video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNIKneo11o4
#129313 - NeX - Mon May 21, 2007 8:51 pm
What about putting half on each screen?
#129320 - dantheman - Mon May 21, 2007 10:13 pm
Not sure exactly what you're referring to (the N64 or the Amiga), but if you're suggesting that we use the 3D hardware on both screens, keep in mind that that would slow it down even more.
#129339 - simonjhall - Mon May 21, 2007 11:22 pm
Oh my god I can't believe this N64 thread is still going...
Sigh,
<goes to google to find N64 emulator with source code>
_________________
Big thanks to everyone who donated for Quake2
#129347 - tepples - Tue May 22, 2007 12:32 am
1964 appears to be free software, but that won't help much.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#129380 - Ant6n - Tue May 22, 2007 5:59 am
one could get somewhat of a bilinear filtering effect if one uses the nearest neighbor downsampling but moves around every frame by like a quarter pixel or so. One could also capture into some bitmap always with some alpha.
o btw, to answer my earlier question, http://www.classicgaming.com/EPR/ appears to have some specs for consoles
#129399 - silent_code - Tue May 22, 2007 1:07 pm
| simonjhall wrote: |
| Oh my god I can't believe this N64 thread is still going... |
exactly what i think each time i see a new post was made... should probably be closed, as it's like half the posts are offtopic. ... or at least only remotely connected to the topic.
#129404 - tepples - Tue May 22, 2007 2:17 pm
A Nintendo 64 emulator on Nintendo DS is not gonna happen.
That's all that needs to be said.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.