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DS development > Frame rate

#47118 - G-Pjube - Tue Jul 05, 2005 11:30 am

? can't find it back, so i'll post it here. Is it possible to cut on the FPS (60) to get more polygons per seconde if you do 30 FPS? I have not really the time for it to look for it somewhere, and someone wishes too know it.

thanks in advance.
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#47120 - PhoenixSoft - Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:47 pm

G-Pjube wrote:
I have not really the time for it to look for it somewhere


Is this a joke or something? Do you seriously think that your time is worth more than ours?

#47124 - G-Pjube - Tue Jul 05, 2005 2:02 pm

PhoenixSoft wrote:
G-Pjube wrote:
I have not really the time for it to look for it somewhere


Is this a joke or something? Do you seriously think that your time is worth more than ours?


*yawn*

That was not the point asking who's time was more valuable. It's just that i'm to busy atm that i don't have the time looking for it.
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#47125 - tepples - Tue Jul 05, 2005 3:15 pm

Until the homebrew community figures out DMA from the rasterizer, you cannot get more polys per scene by rendering a scene in two passes.
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#47134 - sajiimori - Tue Jul 05, 2005 6:19 pm

Quote:
That was not the point asking who's time was more valuable.
Obviously it was not your point. Does the bank robber say, "Don't blame me; my point wasn't to deprive you of money. It was to get more money for myself!"

#47153 - Spaceface - Tue Jul 05, 2005 9:32 pm

I'm ashamed and appologize on behalf of the 15.999.999 other Dutch people

#47158 - sajiimori - Tue Jul 05, 2005 10:09 pm

Frickin Dutch, you can't trust em! :P

#47341 - LunarCrisis - Thu Jul 07, 2005 9:06 pm

tepples wrote:
Until the homebrew community figures out DMA from the rasterizer, you cannot get more polys per scene by rendering a scene in two passes.


AFAIK even when we can do that it would be tricky, unless we have a way to capture/write the depth buffer every scanline -_-
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#47349 - tepples - Thu Jul 07, 2005 10:23 pm

How did games efficiently do depth sorting in the era of software rendering, when a Z buffer was considered too expensive? They used things such as BSPs (binary space partitions), portal engines (a generalization of raycasting), and model sorting. It's tricky, but near the end of DS lifetime, games will be expected to pull it off.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.

#47350 - sajiimori - Thu Jul 07, 2005 10:24 pm

<-- official dev who would like to see that. :o

(Edit: Retaining the depth buffer, that is.)

#47365 - dagamer34 - Fri Jul 08, 2005 4:45 am

sajiimori wrote:
<-- official dev who would like to see that. :o

(Edit: Retaining the depth buffer, that is.)


Ain't that revealing a bit too much.

Meh, as long as mysterious NITRO dev documents don't start flying all over the 'net, with a hidden embedded footprint with sajimori's dev team "written all over it". That wouldn't be a good thing, now would it? :P
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#47395 - tepples - Fri Jul 08, 2005 3:16 pm

It reveals nothing. Nintendo's sprite engines have had the equivalent of a depth buffer ever since the NES. Change "priority" to "depth" throughout the Super NES or GBA documentation, and see if it doesn't look more familiar.

Besides, you wouldn't need to keep the depth buffer if you draw everything in back during one frame and draw everything in front during the next. Sorting in world space before submitting your models to the OpenGL implementation would be straightforward using a BSP or portal engine.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.

#47582 - Volta - Mon Jul 11, 2005 1:14 am

To answer your question, no, you can't shave the fps to have more polygons since the limit is hardware.

However, I know "from someone" that it is possible to display 3D on both screens by using one frame to display it on the bottom screen.

#48135 - bluescrn - Sun Jul 17, 2005 1:28 pm

You could get more polys by software rendering them to textures (or even sprites - as was done by a few GBA games)

For example, in a racing game, you could software render a car into a texture, then put it in the hardware 3D scene as a billboard

Tricky to do well, but definitely possible.

#48147 - octopusfluff - Sun Jul 17, 2005 5:28 pm

I've often heard that technique referred to as 'imposters'.

In particular, you can use it to save rendering time on things far away that either won't be moving much, or perspective will not shift on them much. Clouds, or trees in the far distance.

Only re-render those when perspective has shifted a certain amount, or they get within a certain distance.

Downside is this technique requires more ram (as you're generating a lot of textures), which is at a premium on the DS.

#48153 - tepples - Sun Jul 17, 2005 6:09 pm

You can cache some of the textures in the 4 MB EWRAM and then swap them into VRAM as needed.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.