#28425 - DiscoStew - Sun Oct 31, 2004 7:43 am
Article found at PSP.IGN.COM
I didn't expect Sony to price it that low. They definitely want to mark there place in the handheld gaming market. I read somewhere that Sony is supposably loosing a great deal of money with this price, like $350 per unit. I think it was at GameSpy, but I don't quite remember. They seem to be taking a very great risk with doing this, but if they are capable of sustaining themselves financially, this can be a greater threat than Nintendo is expecting.
I'm still getting a DS, partially for deving when that option is available to us all, but I'm starting to get a little worried about how Nintendo's current and future position with handheld gaming will be affect by Sony's PSP, and their jump into handheld gaming. Sony has already got a large hold on game consoles for the time being, and now they are extending their grasp into the handheld world.
One reason why Nintendo has not yet gone the way of Sega in terms of creating their own hardware is because of the success of the GBA and their success with handheld gaming as a whole. Many times other companies had tried their luck in developing a handheld device to go against Nintendo's GameBoy, with hardware more powerful than the GB, but somehow Nintendo stayed at the top. Now with the competition of the DS and the PSP, it almost feels like the war of the N64 and the PSX has started all over again, except the N64 has supposably more power, 2 screens, touchscreen, etc. , but the PSX is now a PS2. The battle of Innovation vs Horsepower. I fear that unless Nintendo and the companies supporting the DS really put forth their effort into creating unique (and fun) games, the PSP is going to pummel the DS into the ground, even if the majority of PSP games were to become ports or reek with unoriginality (this is in no way foretelling anything).
Anyways, what is everyone else's thoughts on the matter?
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#28426 - expos1994 - Sun Oct 31, 2004 8:07 am
Maybe I'm just getting old (I'm 24), but the idea of playing PS2 or N64 type games on a handheld doesn't excite me.
I'd rather play 8-bit and 16-bit games. With the GBA I can do that nicely.
I have a PS2, and my eyes hurt just thinking about trying to play those games on a tiny screen. I just bought GTA: San Andreas and I can't even read how many bullets my gun has on a 25 inch TV.
I suppose these machines (DS/PSP) were designed to display hi-res graphics, but I'll have to see it implemented well before I get excited about it.
As far as the battle between DS and PSP, I'd say if both pull it off nicely and it really is N64(DS) vs. PS2(PSP), then the PSP will probably win.
In Nintendo's defense, they are the more innovative with the touchscreen and they are also debuting their machine earlier so they will have an advantage early on.
It should be an interesting race, but probably not as interesting as this election we've got coming up on Tuesday. Let's just hope the election will be decided before the PSP vs. DS battle. ;)
#28427 - Andor - Sun Oct 31, 2004 8:10 am
With the PSP firmly entrenched at a price point of $300, Nintendo's near monopoly of the handheld market would have been safe. No doubt Sony realized this, and dropped the MSRP of the PSP to the current $200.
It's obvious that Sony will be losing a lot of money on each PSP sold, but they're a large corporation, and like Microsoft and the XBox, they'll be willing to take the loss in order to manhandle their way into the handheld market.
I want to say, "Nintendo should be very, very frightened now" but I don't see this having a huge effect on our favorite console company. Admittedly, I cannot see the DS appealing to the hardcore gaming crowd, who now have 'Nintendo' firmly entrenched as 'kiddy' in their minds (and also see 'Sony' as being awesome, progressive, and home to some of the 'coolest' games on the market). However, the DS will still appeal to the nintendo-philes and the parents of younger children, and I expect that in a year's time, the handheld market will be split 60/40 in the PSP's favor, with the PSP market share gaining on Nintendo's slice of the pie.
However, I'm optimistic. I don't think Nintendo is going to go the way of the dodo - or even the hedgehog, for that matter. I don't doubt that, come next generation, Nintendo will still be in the hardware market (and still be in third place, behind Sony and Microsoft), and most importantly, they'll still be profitable. They'll still be capitalizing on the same game characters we've come to know and love since childhood. Nothing will change in that respect.
However, the Nintendorks out there will no longer be able to point out Nintendo's 99% share of the handheld market as one of Nintendo's strong points. Oh well. Worse things have happened to Nintendo in the past ten years.
#28428 - Dracula-X - Sun Oct 31, 2004 8:36 am
I expect if both platforms maintain to provide a good diet of good games, both should fare well. Regarding the losses at Sony, there's a quote from Kutaragi on gamespot (http://www.gamespot.com/news/2004/10/29/news_6111820.html) saying they need to sell 3 million units to break even and start making profit. That's really not bad at all and lends itself to the idea that Sony isn't losing that much money (Kutaragi talks more about it), and is a figure that is quite easily within their grasp. I don't think Nintendo has too much to worry about, and neither does Sony for that matter. The consumer will benefit the most from this healthy competition.
#28436 - Abscissa - Sun Oct 31, 2004 9:52 am
| Andor wrote: |
| Admittedly, I cannot see the DS appealing to the hardcore gaming crowd, who now have 'Nintendo' firmly entrenched as 'kiddy' in their minds (and also see 'Sony' as being awesome, progressive, and home to some of the 'coolest' games on the market). |
I see it the other way around. I see the *true* hardcore gamers as the ones seeing beyond the stereotypes, and the casual/mainstream croud as the "omg!1 s0ny r0xorZ!" nuts.
#28438 - mymateo - Sun Oct 31, 2004 10:27 am
My view? Hmm....
Nintendo will suffer until they make the next Gameboy. They say the DS isn't supposed to be next Gameboy, and therefore isn't really in competition with the PSP because it wasn't built for that kind of gaming.
I say that no matter how much Nintendo wants the market to stay warm for the next Gameboy, the public will still view the DS as GameboyDS. After all, it PLAYS all the GBA games, and it's more powerful by about the same amount that GBA was over the GB or GBC. To look at it while ignoring Nintendo, logically it's next. If nobody heard Nintendo say the DS was the third pillar, everyone would believe the DS was replacing the Gameboy, or was even just the next gameboy iteself. Heck, I thought it was the next Gameboy!
This lack of foresight will hurt Nintendo, but I don't think it's going to be that bad in the long run. Nintendo will eventually establish the fact that the DS is more than games when they (or 3rd parties) make software to turn it into voice chat, VoIP (internet phone), internet surfer, PDA, etc. Then, they can come out with their next Gameboy and blow everyone away with awesome gaming capabilities. Let's just hope the Gameboy name survives this little mess.
It's a dog-eat-dog world out there, and Sony just took a bite because Nintendo though they weren't playing.
In closing, DS rules! I've already bought mine and Feel the Magic XY/XX, and Mario 64 DS. *drool*
#28445 - tepples - Sun Oct 31, 2004 7:17 pm
| mymateo wrote: |
| After all, it PLAYS all the GBA games |
No it doesn't. Some GBA games are available only as GameCube extras (Panel de Pon). Some GBA games are wired multiplayer only, albeit on the same Game Pak as a single player title (The Legend of Zelda: Four Swords). It doesn't play GBC games, even those that have GBA extras (The Legend of Zelda: Oracle series).
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#28456 - mymateo - Sun Oct 31, 2004 10:40 pm
Well, if you want to get technical about it...
What I meant was it has support to play GBA games (maybe not all, but most of 'em), and so people will see it as a Gameboy as a result. If Nintendo wanted the DS to appear as a third pillar, NOT supporting GBA games would have helped. It would have hurt their business, but that's aside from the point.
And to go off topic a little, I think it's really stupid that you can't play multiplayer GBA games on the DS. After all, the DS can connect to up to 15 other systems for a total of 16, and 4 is the most you need for any GBA game (unless I'm wrong again?). There's only one reason I can see why they didn't make the DS able to connect wirelessly with other DS's to play multiplayer GBA games: The ARM7 cpu is what will handle playing GBA games. But when playing DS games (therefore using the DS exclusive features), the ARM9 plays the games, and the ARM7 handles the mic, touch, wireless, and sound. This would mean the DS cannot use wireless and GBA games at the same time (unless I'm wrong once again, which happens a lot when tepples reads my posts... not that I mind).
So, in closing, Nintendo should have figured out a way to use GBA games with wireless.
#28465 - DiscoStew - Sun Oct 31, 2004 11:49 pm
Maybe Majesco will create a wireless port (or link port) that connects in the DS slot, or some attachment in the GBA slot. I really do think that Nintendo messed up when creating their wireless adapter for the GBA, since it is only compatible with games supporting it. If they would have done what Majesco had done (creating a wireless adapter compatible with all GBA games), maybe they could have somehow integrated the DS to use the same stuff, perhaps even having DSs wirelessly linking with GBAs (for GBA games of course). Just a thought.
Perhaps we should all contact Majesco and see if they are capable/willing/allowed to make such an attachment for the DS.
| expos1994 wrote: |
| I'd rather play 8-bit and 16-bit games |
If there is one thing I've learned about video games, is that it doesn't require 3D to make a great game, although I think a lot of people would think that because a game has better graphics that it is worth playing. Although we would consider the NES/SNES/Genesis/etc. to be primative to today's technology, there is still that thrill that I get when playing those old 2D games.
| mymateo wrote: |
| The ARM7 cpu is what will handle playing GBA games....This would mean the DS cannot use wireless and GBA games at the same time |
In that instance, I would say it all depend on what the DS is doing when playing GBA games. The ARM7 CPU is 33Mhz (not 16.7Mhz). Whether or not the DS downgrades the ARM7 CPU to 16.7Mhz or runs fine at 33Mhz with half the processing power to spare, or even uses the ARM9 CPU instead is unclear to me (unless they've announced how it works).
I'd love to here an announcement before the DS comes out that GBA games on the DS can play wirelessly with other DSs set in GBA mode.
As for Nintendo's position, I guess it is safe to say along with everyone else that they'll still be creating hardware for a while, and that Sony won't pummel them into a pulp, but will cut into as much of the handheld pie that they can.
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#28481 - Abscissa - Mon Nov 01, 2004 2:59 am
| DiscoStew wrote: |
| As for Nintendo's position, I guess it is safe to say along with everyone else that they'll still be creating hardware for a while, and that Sony won't pummel them into a pulp, but will cut into as much of the handheld pie that they can. |
Right. And I think we need to keep in mind that Nintendo's demonstrated over the last few years that they don't need large market share in order to turn huge profits.
#28489 - mymateo - Mon Nov 01, 2004 9:58 am
Hmmm... I guess I forgot the GBA ran at 16 MHz... so, possibly the other half could easily use the wireless... since I'm sure that 16 channel sound, microphone AND touchscreen would take at LEAST 16 MHz combined, so in that vein I really think there's nothing stopping Nintendo.
Heh, I have a new appreciation for the DS now. All along, for some reason, I thought the ARM7 was the same one the GBA had... now I see that instead of 3x the power, it has 6x... I can't wait!