#91021 - 0xtob - Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:19 am
NitroTracker v0.2 is out!
There's now a sample editor with cutting, deleting, fading, and reversing. Also, you can now adjust sample settings. And of course, some bugs were fixed. For example, wavs that did not load before (because their sampling frequency was too low) should load now.
Please let me know what you think.
Bye,
Tob
#91027 - tepples - Tue Jul 04, 2006 2:08 am
Any chance of being able to set the loop start point any time soon, or to add volume slides? I need both features to make my chiptunes.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#91033 - Mr. Picklesworth - Tue Jul 04, 2006 3:08 am
Hmm... neat :)
The sample editor will keep me amused for a long while.
_________________
Thanks!
MKDS Friend Code: 511165-679586
MP:H Friend Code: 2105 2377 6896
#91046 - HtheB - Tue Jul 04, 2006 6:43 am
Does it support .mod files now? :)
#91048 - tepples - Tue Jul 04, 2006 7:14 am
| HtheB wrote: |
| Does it support .mod files now? :) |
It does if you load them into modplug and save them as XM ;-)
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#91052 - HtheB - Tue Jul 04, 2006 8:29 am
| tepples wrote: |
| HtheB wrote: | | Does it support .mod files now? :) |
It does if you load them into modplug and save them as XM ;-) |
rofl I know :P but I want to use direct mod :P
#91062 - dXtr - Tue Jul 04, 2006 10:29 am
it would also be neat if you added so you can draw/make your own samples in the sample editor with the help of the stylus :)
FT2 had something similar (thought you could only edit already existing samples and not creat new iirc)
can be really nice when making samples for chiptunes
edit:
either that or a sample generator for generating different waveshapes like in mutagen (included in hugi bonus pack 24 http://www.scene.org/file.php?file=/mags/hugi/h24bonus.zip&dummy=1)
_________________
go back to coding and stop screaming wolf :)
#91076 - maaark - Tue Jul 04, 2006 12:49 pm
Hello.
First off, Nitrotracker is great.
The only problem is, I've got an EZ4 Lite (MicroSD), and the EZ4's currently don't work with Chishm's FATlib. Everything in Nitrotracker works, except for the savingscreen (which hangs).
Now I was wondering, as I have an DS Lite, What other flashcart doesn't stick out a lot and works with Nitrotracker (Loading AND Saving)? I'm willing to buy another flashcart just for Nitrotracker and some other homebrew that doesn't work right now.
Offtopic: I had never used a tracker (only sequencers, Reason, Ableton,etc) so it's kinda hard for me getting the timing right... Any tips/suggestions?
#91081 - melw - Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:27 pm
| maaark wrote: |
| I have an DS Lite, What other flashcart doesn't stick out a lot and works with Nitrotracker (Loading AND Saving)? I'm willing to buy another flashcart just for Nitrotracker and some other homebrew that doesn't work right now. |
M3 MiniSD might be a good choice - even if not all homebrew apps support the SD adapters perfectly, the number of working applications is increasing. GBAMP or M3 CompactFlash versions would be a safe bets, but those things are huge and stick out a lot even with the old DS models. :)
#91083 - vb_master - Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:33 pm
Sweet!
_________________
Back.
#91087 - 0xtob - Tue Jul 04, 2006 2:04 pm
| tepples wrote: |
| Any chance of being able to set the loop start point any time soon, or to add volume slides? I need both features to make my chiptunes. |
Looping is practically the next thing on my list. Volume slides might still take a while.
| dXtr wrote: |
| it would also be neat if you added so you can draw/make your own samples in the sample editor with the help of the stylus :) |
Drawing is on my short-term TODO list. I'm also thinking about a simple sample generator, but I'm not sure about that yet.
| maark wrote: |
| I've got an EZ4 Lite (MicroSD), and the EZ4's currently don't work with Chishm's FATlib. |
If the makers of the EZ4Lite release the source code to their build of Moonshell, FAT support for the EZ4Lite might happen. I also think the M3 miniSD is currently a good choice for homebrew on the Lite, but it's very expensive and the miniSD slot feels fragile.
| maark wrote: |
| I had never used a tracker (only sequencers, Reason, Ableton,etc) so it's kinda hard for me getting the timing right... Any tips/suggestions? |
Besides practicing and analysing existing modules, you could have a look at The process of learning to track.
Does anyone know other good tracking tutorials?
Good luck!
Tob
#91128 - maaark - Tue Jul 04, 2006 7:15 pm
Thank you for your replies.
The M3 is indeed a little too expensive for someone who already has a card...
Would the Supercard MiniSD work with Nitrotracker?
I'm thinking about the following pack: http://www.yangke-games.com/pack-supercard-minisd-mbytes-p-197.html
Can't wait to lay down music-ideas while on the road :)
EDIT:
| Quote: |
| If the makers of the EZ4Lite release the source code to their build of Moonshell, FAT support for the EZ4Lite might happen. I also think the M3 miniSD is currently a good choice for homebrew on the Lite, but it's very expensive and the miniSD slot feels fragile. |
Well, I don't know if this would be possible, but maybe it is;
A few days ago the people on the EZ4-forum found out that if you patch (With EZ4client) a file like a certain version of ScummVM which saves to SRAM, the EZ4 loader can write that back to the SD-card (It does that with normal games too). So if all homebrew saved to SRAM, then it could all save... But is it possible to save XM's, WAV's, etc to SRAM?
Oh and I believe they already gave the code to Chishm, although I might be wrong.
EDIT2: http://www.sosuke.com/ezflash/viewtopic.php?t=1423 :
| Quote: |
| I believe Slade is trying to get that very same code right now for our competition. |
Last edited by maaark on Tue Jul 04, 2006 8:16 pm; edited 3 times in total
#91130 - tepples - Tue Jul 04, 2006 7:21 pm
As of July 2006, CF cards are more reliable for saving in homebrew than SD cards. The cheapest way to get started is to buy a GBA Movie Player v2 CF and then flash it with NDSMP.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#91211 - juhees - Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:37 am
| maaark wrote: |
Thank you for your replies.
Would the Supercard MiniSD work with Nitrotracker?
|
Well, it works on SC SD, and i beleave, that the SC miniSD is the same thing (from a coders perspective).
#91257 - Neil - Wed Jul 05, 2006 6:19 pm
Finally got to use this yesterday, been looking forward to it for weeks. And it didn't disappoint! Very impressive program, I never bother reading instructions, and was able to pick it up very quickly. Love the new sample editor, was sat on top of a motte today composing in the blazing sun-shine, happy days :-) I'll hopefully have some bug reports or feature suggestions in a bit, just wanted to say how much I appreciate and enjoy this software.
#91268 - swimgod - Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:45 pm
this app is coming out VERY nicely :D
i have a suggestion,
on the sample editor,
how about a line that goes through it that you can set the speed and point in it
so it would be a graph over it,
X is time
Y is point in the sample
great for creating little loops,
i think FLStudio had that...
or a copy and paste and cut,
to make the sample repeat curtent parts...
lol...
or you can do w/e you want...
just putting out ideas ;)
_________________
1x WII 2x remotes
2x NDS/L(FMv7-ORG:v4,FMv7-org:DSL)
1x GBAMP
2x 1gb (MicroDrive{typeII}&SanDisk{typeI})
1x SuperPass2
1x Supercard-CF
MoonShell skins
#91335 - Neil - Thu Jul 06, 2006 2:59 pm
Just reading through the docs before I make any suggestions, I'm sure there's some handy features I'm still not aware of. Anyway, regards your compatibility list, it works perfectly on the M3 MiniSD.
Right, I do love this program, and the only way I can think of contributing is to make suggestions, so I hope some of these are useful:
Firstly, the included song... it's not a great help to newbs as all the samples have been renamed to be blank (or they're showing up that way)...could be good to rename them so newbs to tracking can take the demo song apart more easily?
Perhaps you could also include another few demo songs too, especially stuff that's been created solely with NitroTracker, such as the links in the other thread. See, when I went to 'The Mod Archive' to download some mods, the two xm files I picked didn't actually load in Nitrotracker.
It's brill that we can record in realtime by pressing record and then play, but how about a count-in? And perhaps a metronome? (EDIT: Ah, just seen the former in the features request section of the wiki!)
How about the ability to load a whole folder of samples with one click? At the minute, each sample needs to be loaded automatically, but it could be nice to have a feature which also lets us load a full directory of samples into the sample bank.
I'm trying to think of things to fill up the options screen...how about tooltips? Again, just thinking of the newbs.
How about including the Docs page of your site as a text file in the NitroTracker zip? Then people could read the instructions from their flash cards.
Smart directories! I keep my tunes and samples in different folders, but have to re-navigate to them each time I want something. If I click "sng", then it would be ace if the last folder I loaded/saved a song from was automatically brought up, ditto with samples. Perhaps this kind of info could be saved along with the mod file too, so that NitroTracker will remember which directories I was in for each song.
Actually, on the smp page, how about some kind of 'Load new' button below the current Load one? This would automatically load a sample into the next slot, rather than the currently highlighted one. Would save people having to manually scroll down, click Load, scroll down again etc.
How about using the other shoulder button to get in and out of record mode? That definitely needs to be more accessible, as I can't see any kind of undo, and it's all too easy to wipe cells when you're pissing around :-) I do like the way the grid changes colour in record mode, nice touch.
The "B" (as in the twelve notes) looks like a W or H to me?!?! Oh, in fact, it does say H on the docs page so this seems to be a deliberate decision...can I ask why? There is no H in the musical scale. Heh, the docs also say "Bolding the B button with accelerate scrolling" which I guess should be "Holding the B button will accelerate scrolling" :-) Nice tip to know!
OK, that's it for now, gonna get back to the tune I'm working on and see if I can think of anything else :-) Well done, NitroTracker really is one of the best pieces of software availble on the DS.
#91353 - tepples - Thu Jul 06, 2006 5:01 pm
Auf D E U T S C ♯ :
| Neil wrote: |
| The "B" (as in the twelve notes) looks like a W or H to me?!?! Oh, in fact, it does say H on the docs page so this seems to be a deliberate decision...can I ask why? There is no H in the musical scale. |
What is called B♭ in English is called B in German, and what is called B in English is called H in German.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#91362 - Neil - Thu Jul 06, 2006 6:41 pm
Aaaaah, that's very interesting, thanks for the explanation.
EDIT: And, heh, I would have to have the excellent Nina Hagen on in the background while I read that :-)
#91426 - Neil - Fri Jul 07, 2006 4:05 am
Just tracking in bed and thought of another couple of suggestions :-)
On the screen with all the channels, it would be really great to have a "clr" button to clear out a cell. At the minute, I'm finding it much too easy to press the "del" button, and consequently I keep moving everything up by mistake and then have to cut and paste it all down again. Then again, the cut button does what I'm after, so nyeh, ignore this one perhaps.
Ok, how about this though. Sample auditioning! Currently you've got to load samples in to hear them, and as I said earlier, it's quite time-consuming. It'd be really great to be able to hear the samples while in the directory listing! There could be an auto-audition, where a sample plays automatically after it's been selected for a few seconds? But I'm thinking more along the lines of using the D-pad to control the directory listing... When you click in there, you would be controlling it rather than the channels screen. Up and down to move up and down the file list, and left or right to play the samples. Hell, maybe you could even make left play the sample forwards, and right play the sample backwards...that'd be a really cool feature.
#91527 - Neil - Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:17 pm
Me again :-)
| Last night, I wrote: |
| On the screen with all the channels, it would be really great to have a "clr" button to clear out a cell. At the minute, I'm finding it much too easy to press the "del" button, and consequently I keep moving everything up by mistake and then have to cut and paste it all down again. Then again, the cut button does what I'm after, so nyeh, ignore this one perhaps. |
Changed my mind about this now! Was tracking in the park there, and realised that if I'm scrolling around the channels with my D-pad, I can't just click Cut to delete the cell I'm currently under. I have to click the cell (as it's waiting for a selection), then click cut. So it would be handy if I could click a "clr" button which would delete whatever is currently under the 'cursor.'
Um, I hope none of this seems too nit-picky, I'm just trying to think of ways that will improve this cracking program. Little time-saving things and attention to detail are always great, and seperate good programs from truly great ones.
Here's a pretty important one though, I think...changing the pattern length at the minute can cause a bit of swearing :-) As you know, you have to drag the stylus up or down to change the length of a pattern...but, it's not very accurate when you're making small changes. When I'm just trying to get rid of (for example) one line, then it can be much too easy to over-shoot and end up taking out two or three...and that can usually take some data with it, which is where the swearing comes in :-) It'd be great to have a seperate up and down arrow to the right of the current "ptn len" section...this would let you fine-tune things by only adding or deleting one line at a time.
Something like that would be a seriously cool addition, I've found myself having to reenter notes countless times now due to this issue.
Finally, I'm wondering how the included mod manages to loop...it plays right through the song, and then goes back to the fifth position, rather than just ending. How do we do this? How do we make a song loop, and how do we set the point where it will loop back to?
#91714 - 0xtob - Sat Jul 08, 2006 11:54 pm
| swimgod wrote: |
on the sample editor,
how about a line that goes through it that you can set the speed and point in it |
That sounds interesting, but it's not a feature of XM, so including it would break XM-support and I don't want to do this right now (but maybe later). Anyways, thanks :-)
| Neil wrote: |
| Firstly, the included song... it's not a great help to newbs as all the samples have been renamed to be blank (or they're showing up that way)...could be good to rename them so newbs to tracking can take the demo song apart more easily? |
Good point. I always thought of the included song more as a demo than as a teaching example. I'll probably do something about this. | Neil wrote: |
| How about the ability to load a whole folder of samples with one click? At the minute, each sample needs to be loaded automatically, but it could be nice to have a feature which also lets us load a full directory of samples into the sample bank. |
Good idea. Shouldn't be too hard.
| Neil wrote: |
| I'm trying to think of things to fill up the options screen...how about tooltips? Again, just thinking of the newbs. |
I thought about tooltips too, but I'm not sure how to realize them as "hovering" with the pen is not really possible with a touch screen. Perhaps you'd have to hold down some button (like R) and them tap on a control to get a help window that explains the function of the control. And don't worry, the options screen will get stuffed soon enough :-)
| Neil wrote: |
| How about including the Docs page of your site as a text file in the NitroTracker zip? Then people could read the instructions from their flash cards. |
The docs as pure text would be bad, because they heavily rely on images. Also it would be exhausting to always switch between a text viewer and the tracker to follow a tutorial. I think the "tooltip"-idea would be enough online documentation.
| Neil wrote: |
| Smart directories! ... |
I just copy-pasted this to my TODO-list, and the "load new" idea too :-)
| Neil wrote: |
| How about using the other shoulder button to get in and out of record mode? |
This was suggested several times and will be implemented soon. I'm still thinking of a way to make the record mode more obvious when it's activated, so people don't mess up their songs by mistake. It happens to me all the time, too. Changing the grid color helped a bit, but didn't quite do it. Perhaps I should change the background color of the lower screen, or blink the LEDs?
| Neil wrote: |
| Oh, in fact, it does say H on the docs page so this seems to be a deliberate decision...can I ask why? |
Like tepples explained, we use H here instead if B. I never noticed that other countries use B until someone complained about it. But I think I'll leave it at that, if no one is strongly objecting to it.
| Neil wrote: |
| On the screen with all the channels, it would be really great to have a "clr" button to clear out a cell. |
How about this: I'll add a "clr" button to the top screen and place "del", "clr" and "--" exactly the same as on the bottom screen. This would be the easiest solution IMO.
| Neil wrote: |
| Ok, how about this though. Sample auditioning! |
I wanted to do this as soon as the loading dialog was implemented, but I forgot about it somehow. So, thanks for reminding me :-)
| Neil wrote: |
| Was tracking in the park there |
Nice that you're really using it everywhere ^^
| Neil wrote: |
| changing the pattern length at the minute can cause a bit of swearing |
It sure can. Your new coarse-and-fine-numberslider widget would be an idea. Another idea I have for this is to just not internally delete the content of the lines that disappear. So, when you make pattern too short by accident and then make it longer again, your notes will still be there. That should not be too heavy on the ram usage and would not require a new widget class.
| Neil wrote: |
| Finally, I'm wondering how the included mod manages to loop...it plays right through the song, and then goes back to the fifth position, rather than just ending. How do we do this? How do we make a song loop, and how do we set the point where it will loop back to? |
Well, that's because my XM player library has more features than the tacker GUI. It also already supports forward loops while you can't yet define them in the GUI. But that one is particularly easy to add, so it will probably be there in the next version.
| Neil wrote: |
| Um, I hope none of this seems too nit-picky, I'm just trying to think of ways that will improve this cracking program. Little time-saving things and attention to detail are always great, and seperate good programs from truly great ones. |
I completely agree with that and I absolutely don't think you're nit-picky. It's these tiny things that have a serious impact on the workflow and usability.
So, thank you very very much for your suggestions. You can probably except to see most of these things in the next versions. Your help is much appreciated! If anything else comes to your mind, please let me know!
Bye and thanks!
Tob
#91720 - emphyrian - Sun Jul 09, 2006 12:27 am
This program is so awesome.
Shame I havnt used it yet because I keep putting off what bloody flash equipment I should get. Is there one, definitive guide around with the pro's and cons etc of each one? I got recomended some (mini sd) stuff in another thread, but then I have seen that compact flash is better at the moment?
The cheapest, easiest way of running things like this, emus and scumm, without modifying my DS would be great, but the options are soooo overwhelming.
Keep up the good work on this prog though, its awesome.
Mike
#91725 - 0xtob - Sun Jul 09, 2006 12:57 am
Hi!
There is really no definite solution for homebrew as each one has its pros and cons. The only thing one can certainly say, is that NoPass devices are the easiest solution for running DS code off the GBA slot.
The storage device depends on what you want to do: If you just want DS homebrew and don't care too much about sticking out, get a GBAMP.
If you also want GBA homebrew and demos, you need to get a card with internal RAM, like Supercard or M3. The Supercard is cheaper than the M3 but is said to have lower production quality and higher battery usage than the M3. Both devices are worse for DS homebrew than the GBAMP, because they were not primarily produced with homebrew in mind. At the moment, CF cards have better support from the FATlib, and thus from homebrew that accesses the FAT, but that is going to change.
Concerning NitroTracker: It runs fine on the devices in the compatibility list, except that file operations are very slow on SuperCard SD.
Also have a look at the hardware page in the DS Wiki.
Hope this helps with your decision-making.
Tob
#91986 - emphyrian - Mon Jul 10, 2006 11:33 pm
Wow, thats awesome dude. CHeers for the run down.
I got a week before I get paid to start making some decisions, but thanks for the explinations. :)
Mike
#92006 - emphyrian - Tue Jul 11, 2006 1:44 am
Well, it looks like the best thing to do would be to go for
PASSCARD 3
M3 adapter mini sd
SD card
but man, thats expensive! (At least for me at the moment.) Lol.
I shall have to keep an eye on ebay.
Thaks again
Mike
#92071 - daninski - Tue Jul 11, 2006 12:31 pm
i didnt realise that my supercard sd was uniquely slow, i feel all inferior now. patient but inferior :)
does the new fatlib speed things up for me do you think?
i love nitrotracker btw, would pay money for it on an sd card, did you ever see nanoloop? i really enjoyed using that as well.