#131655 - Masterofdarkness - Mon Jun 18, 2007 9:36 pm
Do you think it would be possible to make a program called Youtube DS?
It would be a simple webpage browser,but could read the flash format and play videos? Images or no images your choice, and try to make it not use over 4mb?
#131657 - Lick - Mon Jun 18, 2007 9:52 pm
Search 'youtube' in Nintendo DS forum, return results as posts.
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#131679 - Masterofdarkness - Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:01 am
I don't wanna have to stay at my personal computer to use youtube and dshobro. That would defeat the purpose of it on ds..
O i see that you Lick, I didn't know you could connect to your computer by any hotspot:)
I'm trying to edit ports, sometimes i get an error on ds hobro and sometimes i do, what am i doing wrong :(
#131687 - tepples - Tue Jun 19, 2007 2:12 am
Due to CPU limitations, videos would run too slowly on the DS to be watchable.
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#131698 - Masterofdarkness - Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:25 am
So Ram wouldn't help?
#131700 - tepples - Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:53 am
The only way that RAM could possibly help is if a program would download the FLV, decode it a few frames at a time, transcode them to DPG or some other DS-friendly format, and play the DPG. Playback would run in real time, but the transcoding would still be excruciatingly slow.
But do you have to act out a misinterpretation of a Fall Out Boy song?
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#131701 - dantheman - Tue Jun 19, 2007 5:02 am
Yeah, the best method you have at the moment is to use a downloader app to grab the *.flv files from Youtube and convert them to DPG using BatchDPG or DPGtools (I could never get BatchDPG to convert FLV files correctly, but it's mostly an error on my end).
I realize this isn't at all what you're looking for, but it's the only thing there is to mention.
#131762 - Masterofdarkness - Tue Jun 19, 2007 9:23 pm
Ok forget that now...I just want to figure out why DS Hobro won't work, i allowed the port but i get message that doesn't allow access to the port...
#131772 - Darkflame - Wed Jun 20, 2007 12:55 am
More chance of a specific ds-streaming site,imo :p
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#131783 - tondopie - Wed Jun 20, 2007 2:09 am
You could have someone set up a site with a DSO database with DPGs and you could download and watch them from there, it would take a while though...
#131793 - Ant6n - Wed Jun 20, 2007 4:12 am
why not create, like, a second internet altogether? like a server that takes webpages and converts them to ds friendly format, and caches them.
#131811 - OOPMan - Wed Jun 20, 2007 11:41 am
Man, I do so love the stupid questions we get now and then :-)
YouTube DS plzzzzzzzz?!?!?!?!?!
Do people even think about what they post?
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#131819 - tepples - Wed Jun 20, 2007 1:57 pm
| Ant6n wrote: |
| why not create, like, a second internet altogether? like a server that takes webpages and converts them to ds friendly format, and caches them. |
You mean something like Opera Mini?
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#131848 - mastertop101 - Wed Jun 20, 2007 6:27 pm
| Masterofdarkness wrote: |
| Ok forget that now...I just want to figure out why DS Hobro won't work, i allowed the port but i get message that doesn't allow access to the port... |
Well, even if you could, you wouldn't get the sound, and the framerate would probably be damn bad..
#131849 - sonny_jim - Wed Jun 20, 2007 6:32 pm
| tepples wrote: |
| You mean something like Opera Mini? |
Just to clarify, you mean Opera Mini which runs on phones etc, not the Opera DS Browser? I seem to remember reading a reply on here that stated quite categorically that Opera DS does NOT use an external server to process pages.
#131851 - kusma - Wed Jun 20, 2007 6:48 pm
| sonny_jim wrote: |
| tepples wrote: | | You mean something like Opera Mini? |
Just to clarify, you mean Opera Mini which runs on phones etc, not the Opera DS Browser? I seem to remember reading a reply on here that stated quite categorically that Opera DS does NOT use an external server to process pages. |
Yes, he said Opera Mini (which does), and not Opera for Nintendo DS (which doesn't).
#131856 - Devil_Spawn - Wed Jun 20, 2007 7:36 pm
you could possibly do it with the use of streaming media from a pc, but i dont see the point
#131874 - tondopie - Wed Jun 20, 2007 10:38 pm
I can't see why people just can't just use youtube on their computer...
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#131876 - Flyfishing - Wed Jun 20, 2007 11:03 pm
| tondopie wrote: |
| I can't see why people just can't just use youtube on their computer... |
What if you don't have access to your computer? And are in a public area that has Wi-Fi available with your DS? I'm not saying that it's practical, but that would be a use for it...
#131881 - Masterofdarkness - Thu Jun 21, 2007 12:48 am
I go around some of the urban area and steal wifi, check the weather, go online check gamefaqs and engadget, and play some games
#131888 - Dood77 - Thu Jun 21, 2007 1:29 am
Yes he means for phones.
And stop bashing this guy, he didn't demand a program, he didn't assert that it HAS to be possible, he just simply asked if it could be done.
Something along the lines of what Ant6n said about an in-between server... we could have a nice server that would do the transcoding, et cetera for us, but streaming would be pretty slow at 2Mbps...
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#131937 - tepples - Thu Jun 21, 2007 1:49 pm
| Dood77 wrote: |
| Something along the lines of what Ant6n said about an in-between server... we could have a nice server that would do the transcoding, et cetera for us |
What advertiser would pay for the bandwidth should this become popular?
| Quote: |
| but streaming would be pretty slow at 2Mbps... |
2 Mbps is the bitrate of a typical DPG file. How much overhead have people been seeing with dswifi?
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#131985 - doedill - Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:36 pm
Flash is highly memory intensive. Even the new iPhone doesn't support Flash playback.
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#132038 - jester - Fri Jun 22, 2007 5:32 pm
I think with enough thought something like this is possible.
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#132042 - Darkflame - Fri Jun 22, 2007 6:12 pm
Possibly yes, but the question is will it be worth the effort.
Might end up with nothing more then an animated-gif type thing.
Id rather have normal (non-video) flash support.
Which is possible, (there was an unoptimised demo), but its very hard.
Newgrounds on the DS would be nice ;)
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#132043 - sonny_jim - Fri Jun 22, 2007 6:15 pm
Well, I'd like to see someone knock up any kind of streaming video client for the DS. I've got a sneaky suspicion that it's probably not going to work too well, due the fact that:
A. If you have a large video file, it won't need processing as much on the DS CPU, but it'll chew up the wifi bandwidth too much
B. If you have a small video file, it'll transfer quick enough but the DS CPU won't have enough horses to decode.
Just my two cents.
#132051 - dantheman - Fri Jun 22, 2007 7:14 pm
Well, there's currently a way to somewhat stream video to your DS. It's not very good, but it's unique at least. Use a webcam to capture an image of your PC monitor. Use DSCam to stream the contents of your webcam to your DS.
Video demonstration at http://dannysied.googlepages.com/DSstreamingpossibilities.mpg
#132053 - jester - Fri Jun 22, 2007 7:42 pm
could that be applied to Beup but without the pc aspect?
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#132229 - Dood77 - Sun Jun 24, 2007 9:26 pm
| tepples wrote: |
| Dood77 wrote: | | Something along the lines of what Ant6n said about an in-between server... we could have a nice server that would do the transcoding, et cetera for us |
What advertiser would pay for the bandwidth should this become popular? |
Yeah, thats an issue, but hypothetically the technology would work. Not worth the trouble of actually trying to get funding.
| tepples wrote: |
| Quote: | | but streaming would be pretty slow at 2Mbps... |
2 Mbps is the bitrate of a typical DPG file. How much overhead have people been seeing with dswifi? |
I don't know about anyone else, but the fastest I've seen my DS download off my cable internet (which averages at 4-5Mbps) is ~25kbytes/sec. And that was rare.
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#132272 - pas - Mon Jun 25, 2007 10:55 am
Ok, I got an Idea:
Would it work to first download the file to the DS as an .flv using this:
http://javimoya.com/blog/youtube_de.php
then open another program on the DS to convert it
and finally use moonshell to play it.
?
That can't take up that much memory, or ?
It would be very impractical, but hey, it would work, or ?
I think the step which would push the DS to it's limits would be the encoding.
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#132283 - chuckstudios - Mon Jun 25, 2007 2:33 pm
Why do you end your sentences with "or ?"
But yeah, encoding on the DS is going to be nigh on impossible. It can take a while on my x86 computer with a 1.5GHz processor and 512MB RAM, why would it be anywhere near fast running on a 66MHz processor with 4MB RAM?
#132408 - pas - Tue Jun 26, 2007 1:53 pm
I do this cause my sentence is a statement and a questeions at the same time.
So if the encoding won't get better it will be impossible. END.
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#132420 - simonjhall - Tue Jun 26, 2007 2:29 pm
Ooh you've both got the same post count and have started on the same day of the month, six months apart, of the same year... Spooky.
Anyway, yeah decoding + rencoding would be a killer. It would be easier just to get the decoder working well.
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#132435 - Darkflame - Tue Jun 26, 2007 6:09 pm
Well, you could probably dump to sequenced bmp :p
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Last edited by Darkflame on Wed Jun 27, 2007 12:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
#132456 - Gunnex - Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:18 pm
If you want youtube vids so bad, go to mediaconverter.org and download the standalone converter. It is easy to use and does a great job.
#132962 - sdk - Mon Jul 02, 2007 4:58 am
Why do you have to convert the flash to a DPG? Is there not a flash player or way to play flash, ported to the DS, and if so, why is it so difficult?
#133039 - Dood77 - Mon Jul 02, 2007 9:40 pm
I don't know too many technical reasons... but I'm not sure that its impossible for an FLV player to be done, but either it would not play at full speed, or it would require a genius coder. As far as I know, DPG uses relatively simple/old technology for its compression (MPEG-2?) so it's easier for the DS to decompress. FLV is obviously newer and requires more processing power, and maybe more RAM... as I said I'm not the most enlightened person about these things.
There was a flash player (not FLV, SWF.) that someone threw together a long time ago, but it played nowhere near to full speed, and obviously it wouldn't have very up-to-date FAT drivers, etc.
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#133203 - dantheman - Wed Jul 04, 2007 12:29 am
The flash demo in question is available from http://natrium42.com/blog/?p=36
#136720 - spalnndsstest - Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:12 am
most of companies use flash for streaming video,
the reason? the always problem of codecs,
flash suxs for videos, too much power is need, i can't even play them smoothly in my old celeron 500 mhz!
if a flash video = 5 mb
the same video in wmv will need 2 mb and will got much more quality.
flash suxs.
#136728 - Nintendo Maniac 64 - Sat Aug 04, 2007 4:12 am
ummm.... how do I put this...
6|24\/3|)1661|\|6 anyone?
#144886 - mufunyo - Thu Nov 08, 2007 11:24 pm
According to this website, the DS is capable of decoding MPEG-4 video, which is what FLV usually is. I'm not sure what YouTube's video resolution is (I know it's rather poor, but it'll probably be slightly more than 256x192), but with some handwritten assembly and optimal usage of the 2D hardware (the sprite engine lends itself to primitive motion compensation), it should be possible to write an MPEG4/FLV decoder for the DS. You'd just be able to view the video though, not any of the other features the html-embedded flash player on the youtube website offers, though you could probably hard-code the comments system and such to allow basic navigation similar to the website, but without using HTML/Flash (and the system would break anytime YouTube does a backend update).
#144915 - Dood77 - Fri Nov 09, 2007 4:41 am
The commercial ActImagine codec uses MPEG-4, and on both screens too.
But, yeah it was programmed with the official devkit, and yeah it's only available to commercial developers.
Lets all spam Google to throw together Youtube DS!
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Supercard: miniSD, Kingston 1GB, Kingston 2GB
Ralink chipset PCI NIC
#144925 - HyperHacker - Fri Nov 09, 2007 9:23 am
Speaking of which, anyone know why I can grab the FLV and some of them will encode for Moonshell fine, but others will say "can't get frame rate"? Any way to encode those?
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#144938 - pas - Fri Nov 09, 2007 4:26 pm
Throw them at the Encoder and just encoda (after the error). Worked for every of my Youtubex Vids until now.
#144941 - GoopyMonkey - Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:57 pm
The SUPER converter by eRightSoft now seems to have support for MoonShell's DPG format, I can convert FLVs fine now, since dpgtools decided that it couldn't find any audio stream any more. :(
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#144982 - OSW - Sat Nov 10, 2007 12:34 am
but i have a feeling that SUPER converts into an older dpg version - DPG1 or DPG2.
#144997 - HyperHacker - Sat Nov 10, 2007 7:40 am
What? O_o
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#145046 - pas - Sun Nov 11, 2007 12:58 am
| HyperHacker wrote: |
| What? O_o |
lol ^^
#145051 - dantheman - Sun Nov 11, 2007 1:13 am
| OSW wrote: |
| but i have a feeling that SUPER converts into an older dpg version - DPG1 or DPG2. |
Right, as far as I know BatchDPG and SUPER use an older version while DPGTools and DPGmux use the latest version.
#145366 - pas - Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:46 pm
aka DPG HQ 3
#146116 - Linkiboy - Thu Nov 29, 2007 2:22 am
Would m.youtube.com be possible? I think it would be better to start there first.
#146144 - mute - Thu Nov 29, 2007 4:56 pm
| Linkiboy wrote: |
| Would m.youtube.com be possible? I think it would be better to start there first. |
Sounds better. Mobile phones can do it.. But lots of mobile phones outpower the DS, sadly. :)
Looks like YouTube is converting their library to H.264 for this, which is also known as MPEG-4 Part 10, or AVC (for Advanced Video Coding). Wikipedia says the PSP can decode that.. But even a specialized decoder which only took into account the resolution and features used by YouTube to convert their media to H.264 might be much, but I'm no expert. 66MHz ARM9 just sounds like a lot less than 220MHz phones.
Some googling found this:
| Quote: |
TIVR's VC-1 decoder benchmarking results show that Real-time (15 fps) decoding of QVGA (320?240) resolution VC-1 Simple Profile streams coded at 192 kbps is achievable with 37 MHz of ARM9 CPU load (on an average).
In addition to VC-1 decoder, TIVR provides efficient solutions for H.264, MPEG-4, H.263 video decoders and AAC, BSAC audio decoders. |
and then...
| Quote: |
| TIVR?s H.264/AVC decoder benchmark results show that Real-time (25 fps) decoding of QVGA (320x240) resolution H.264 Baseline Profile streams coded at 256 kbps is achievable on ARM9 based devices running at 220 MHz. |
Maybe if we wanna make a SLOT-2 hardware decoder. I think those ICs are only like $10 ... Then we can decode it all, muahah!!! :)
#146153 - mufunyo - Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:10 pm
| Quote: |
TIVR's VC-1 decoder benchmarking results show that Real-time (15 fps) decoding of QVGA (320?240) resolution VC-1 Simple Profile streams coded at 192 kbps is achievable with 37 MHz of ARM9 CPU load (on an average).
In addition to VC-1 decoder, TIVR provides efficient solutions for H.264, MPEG-4, H.263 video decoders and AAC, BSAC audio decoders. |
VC-1 (aka MSFT WMV9) is a mutation of MPEG-4 Advanced Simple Profile (for those wondering about patents, Microsoft is part of the MPE Group, so they can do anything they want with the tech), and those performance numbers listed in that quote seem to match with the fact that games utilising the ActImagine SDK (which is an implementation of the MPEG-4 ASP codec) can decode two full DS screens in real-time (15fps). I think I've already posted earlier in this thread that the DS is capable of decoding full-framerate (24fps) fullscreen MPEG4 ASP videos using Caiman's video codec.
Come to think of it, that Caiman person seems to want to sell his (closed-source) codec, but a) he uses homebrew tools, and b) he doesn't appear to be paying the MPEG-LA licencing fees for MPEG-4. Ouch :)
#146182 - chishm - Fri Nov 30, 2007 2:57 am
I've managed to get full screen xvid decoding at 12fps with mono mp3 audio at 48kHz. Of course, to prevent dropped frames, I'm currently limiting the frame rate to 10fps. It looks good for cartoons.
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#146184 - Lick - Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:38 am
TVersity serving/streaming to DS, anyone?
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