#72028 - shaz - Thu Feb 16, 2006 1:20 am
DS web browser to come with RAM expansion
The Nintendo DS web browser (powered by Opera) will be shipping in Japan with an RAM expansion card that slips into the unused GBA slot. This will help to make your time spent on the web a lot smoother. CVG talked with Nintendo to discuss if the RAM expansion will be used to help out DS games in general?
We asked Nintendo whether we can expect to see DS titles utilising this additional RAM in the future but were told no plans are currently in place.
As was mentioned earlier, there is no official release date for the web browser anywhere outside Japan, but Uk?ers and Americans alike are keeping their fingers crossed in the hopes that something will be confirmed soon.
Source:http://www.computerandvideogames.com/front_index.php?
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#72031 - Mr. Picklesworth - Thu Feb 16, 2006 1:47 am
In a way, I hope that this doesn't get used much... unless this RAM expansion is very, very, inexpensive. It could add a bit too much complexity, and cause a lot of bother.
Could be great for homebrew, though... Except that we're already using Slot-2 :(
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#72036 - swimgod - Thu Feb 16, 2006 2:36 am
i heard some where it is gonna be 10mb
which is twice the ds's current ram
i wonder if thats enough to stream video
:P
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#72042 - tepples - Thu Feb 16, 2006 3:30 am
| Mr. Picklesworth wrote: |
In a way, I hope that this doesn't get used much... unless this RAM expansion is very, very, inexpensive. It could add a bit too much complexity, and cause a lot of bother.
Could be great for homebrew, though... Except that we're already using Slot-2 :( |
That's why you use an M3 or SuperCard. It has the 32 MB RAM expansion (although no byte writes) and the CF interface.
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#72059 - HyperHacker - Thu Feb 16, 2006 4:58 am
Ooooh. A Nintendo product I'm already planning to buy comes with a GBA slot RAM expansion. Woot.
Now I just need to convince them to add an SD slot and maybe USB port. I like to download things when I surf after all. ;-)
#72060 - GragonSon - Thu Feb 16, 2006 5:12 am
what product are u talking about?
#72083 - tssf - Thu Feb 16, 2006 8:18 am
| GragonSon wrote: |
| what product are u talking about? |
The first post pretty much explained this very well. No need to reiterate, just read it again. :)
| Quote: |
i heard some where it is gonna be 10mb
which is twice the ds's current ram |
Doesn't the DS have only 4 megabytes RAM? Last I checked, that was 8 doubled :D
| Quote: |
In a way, I hope that this doesn't get used much... unless this RAM expansion is very, very, inexpensive. It could add a bit too much complexity, and cause a lot of bother.
Could be great for homebrew, though... Except that we're already using Slot-2 :( |
Is the M3's RAM expansion limited to the GBA port's limitation? Wouldn't Nintendo's add-on have the same limitation? If so, I really don't see why it would matter much anymore.
But since the DS card encryption has been cracked, actual DS flash cards could probably be made, so needs for GBA flash carts would probably be in the past.
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#72084 - PhoenixSoft - Thu Feb 16, 2006 8:22 am
| shaz wrote: |
| The Nintendo DS web browser (powered by Opera)... |
Try reading the thread.
EDIT: Beaten by tssf :(
#72105 - Darkflame - Thu Feb 16, 2006 2:08 pm
| swimgod wrote: |
i heard some where it is gonna be 10mb
which is twice the ds's current ram
i wonder if thats enough to stream video
:P |
From the internet? I think codecs would be the problem there.
We can already stream video nicely of CF with moonshell though, thank you very much :)
#72112 - shaz - Thu Feb 16, 2006 2:59 pm
It will not support Java Applets, Adobe Flash and PDF Formats.
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#72113 - shaz - Thu Feb 16, 2006 3:01 pm
Oh and Handwriting is supported.
Write Text instead of Typing...
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#72163 - Dudu.exe - Thu Feb 16, 2006 7:52 pm
#72421 - HyperHacker - Sat Feb 18, 2006 1:16 pm
Heh, I wonder if the browser will be able to use M3's RAM? I'd laugh if it did, especially if it used all 32MB. (Assuming Nintendo doesn't make theirs 32MB as it is... 10 seems like a strange amount.)
#72431 - mastertop101 - Sat Feb 18, 2006 3:57 pm
it seems like there will be a gba ram extension for ds lite and one for DS O_o
#72432 - HtheB - Sat Feb 18, 2006 3:57 pm
| HyperHacker wrote: |
| Heh, I wonder if the browser will be able to use M3's RAM? I'd laugh if it did, especially if it used all 32MB. (Assuming Nintendo doesn't make theirs 32MB as it is... 10 seems like a strange amount.) |
I think that opera will be hacked to use the M3 as a save directory (on the CF/SD card)
:)
(I hope)
#72433 - MaHe - Sat Feb 18, 2006 4:03 pm
HyperHacker: Almost impossible (it probably uses some other RAM 'unlock' code).
http://www.dslinux.org/blogs/pepsiman/?p=22
HtheB: Impossible.
#72435 - HtheB - Sat Feb 18, 2006 4:17 pm
Why impossible?
#72445 - tepples - Sat Feb 18, 2006 5:06 pm
| MaHe wrote: |
| HyperHacker: Almost impossible (it probably uses some other RAM 'unlock' code). |
Doesn't mean the people over at pirate heaven won't figure out how to make it use the M3 or SC RAM instead of Nintendo RAM cart.
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#72449 - m2pt5 - Sat Feb 18, 2006 5:20 pm
| HtheB wrote: |
I think that opera will be hacked to use the M3 as a save directory (on the CF/SD card)
:)
(I hope) |
I hope the same happens for Supercard / Supercard SD.
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#72454 - MaHe - Sat Feb 18, 2006 5:54 pm
| HtheB wrote: |
| Why impossible? |
Well, to incorporate more functions in the program itself, you'd have to disassemble it back to source code, which is, practically impossible.
And since file downloading won't be included ... :)
#72455 - tepples - Sat Feb 18, 2006 5:57 pm
| MaHe wrote: |
| Well, to incorporate more functions in the program itself, you'd have to disassemble it back to source code |
Tell that to anybody who has ever translated a Super NES RPG. Or even tell that to the maintainers of FlashMe.
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#72457 - HtheB - Sat Feb 18, 2006 6:04 pm
| tepples wrote: |
| MaHe wrote: | | Well, to incorporate more functions in the program itself, you'd have to disassemble it back to source code |
Tell that to anybody who has ever translated a Super NES RPG. Or even tell that to the maintainers of FlashMe. |
nice one! :)
but uhm.... I heard some rumors that there will be a GBA expansion cartridge so you can update download things to it...
EDIT: Oh .. I found another thing :)
As details trickle in as to the full extent of Nintendo's browser plans for its increasingly-essential DS portable, fresh information on the technology underpinning the Internet software is starting to trickle out.
To enable a smooth web experience, the DS will receive a RAM upgrade, via the Game Boy Advance cartridge slot. The add-on will be bundled with the Opera browser DS cart, the whole package costing just a shade under 20 quid in Japan. No US or European announcement regarding the surfing software has yet surfaced, though something is expected within the next fortnight.
Nintendo has not disclosed how beefy the injection of RAM will be for the DS, nor has it opted to comment on possible future applications for the memory upgrade. Speculation is rife the the DS will follow in the footsteps of the Nintendo 64, which successfully deployed a RAM upgrade used in games including Perfect Dark, Zelda: Majora's Mask, Turok 2 and Banjo Tooie, though Nintendo declined to comment on the possibility at time of press.
:)
#72496 - chishm - Sun Feb 19, 2006 1:40 am
| tepples wrote: |
| MaHe wrote: | | Well, to incorporate more functions in the program itself, you'd have to disassemble it back to source code |
Tell that to anybody who has ever translated a Super NES RPG. Or even tell that to the maintainers of FlashMe. |
There's a difference between changing a few lines (skip WMB signature check) and adding completely new functionality, like replacing pictochat with a UDP/IP based version. I think the point MaHe was making, is that you'd need pretty much the original source to add a download function.
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#72508 - MaHe - Sun Feb 19, 2006 8:12 am
My point exactly. Try to add a new audio format to MoonShell or a wifi-update function. Modifying only the precompiled .nds file. I don't think it's easy.
#72521 - G-Pjube - Sun Feb 19, 2006 2:40 pm
I do hope they also use the expansion pack for more apps and games in the future. If it's just 10MB's of RAM, who would care? 10MB's of RAM isn't as expensive as it was 10 years ago =P
In that way, I hope to see better games as in graphics. Sport, racing and fight games can use this in my opinion. (other games too offcourse ;) )
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#72553 - shaz - Sun Feb 19, 2006 9:08 pm
Where does it say its going to be 10MB?
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#72558 - tssf - Sun Feb 19, 2006 9:41 pm
If Nintendo was smart, they wouldn't include a RAM expansion, they would include an SD CARD reader. That way anything downloaded/saved could easily be brought back to PC/Mac-level.
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#72559 - JaJa - Sun Feb 19, 2006 9:57 pm
| tssf wrote: |
| If Nintendo was smart, they wouldn't include a RAM expansion, they would include an SD CARD reader. That way anything downloaded/saved could easily be brought back to PC/Mac-level. |
Yeah, well apart from not being fast enough, not everyone having an SD card and the life-span issue there's nothing stopping the SD "Ram" idea.
#72561 - HtheB - Sun Feb 19, 2006 10:21 pm
sd card reader--> SUPERCARD/ M3
well... the M3 has 32MB ram extra :)
#72569 - m2pt5 - Mon Feb 20, 2006 12:00 am
| HtheB wrote: |
sd card reader--> SUPERCARD/ M3
well... the M3 has 32MB ram extra :) |
So does the Supercard. And it's cheaper.
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#72674 - tepples - Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:52 pm
Someone in another thread speculated that the expansion RAM would be slow, given that it uses the GBA slot and its 15/7 wait state timing (relative to the ARM9 clock speed). The difference is that unlike the GBA, the Nintendo DS has a cache.
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#72683 - agentq - Tue Feb 21, 2006 12:01 am
Does the cache cover the GBA cart's address range? I assumed it was uncached for some reason.
#72691 - tepples - Tue Feb 21, 2006 1:38 am
I'm guessing that it depends on what the ARM9 loads into the coprocessor registers. It may just be the case that default configuration used by current versions of official and libnds boot code happens to turn off caching for 0x08000000-0x09FFFFFF.
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#72701 - ssj4android - Tue Feb 21, 2006 3:18 am
Is it impossible for apps now to use the Supercard/M3 RAM?
#72704 - tepples - Tue Feb 21, 2006 3:41 am
It's impossible for official apps to use SuperCard or M3 RAM because in official games, the official ARM7 binary controls access to SLOT-2 and only grants the ARM9 access if the GBA cart's header matches a copy stored in the DS game. Official developers can only use an ARM7 binary developed by Nintendo.
But for homebrew, the unlock sequences for SuperCard and M3 RAM are known and listed here.
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#72721 - lambi1982 - Tue Feb 21, 2006 5:37 am
It would be awesome to be able to WMB nds file larger that 4mb to the DS using the expansion pak
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#72725 - tepples - Tue Feb 21, 2006 5:52 am
That's doable now: write a TFTP client and put it on your M3 or SuperCard.
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#73092 - HyperHacker - Thu Feb 23, 2006 9:32 am
| MaHe wrote: |
| My point exactly. Try to add a new audio format to MoonShell or a wifi-update function. Modifying only the precompiled .nds file. I don't think it's easy. |
You need to talk to some ROM hackers. It's amazing the things people can do with only a precompiled binary if they just take the time to learn how it works. Hell, the amount of new features people have added to Super Mario World alone is crazy. Ability to play other games' music and simple MP3s, new compression formats, removal of nearly all restrictions of the original programming, customized objects and enemies, new powerups, you name it. A lot of games have also had variable-width fonts added. Heck, I myself am working on a Pok?mon Silver hack with, already implemented and working:
-Debug and music select menus
-Added game stats such as number of steps taken
-Ability to use the GBC's features (tile flip/priority, added RAM, double CPU speed)
-More map tiles (normally you have 127 different 32x32 tiles, each composed of any of 60 different 8x8 tiles, to build maps with; I've increased it to 255 32x32 tiles composed of 256 different 8x8 tiles)
And more new features in the works. (Map compression is almost working.) It's really not that difficult, once you learn how the game is programmed. Most of my code just uses what's already there. :p
#73155 - tepples - Thu Feb 23, 2006 5:56 pm
| HyperHacker wrote: |
| Hell, the amount of new features people have added to Super Mario World alone is crazy. Ability to play other games' music and simple MP3s, new compression formats, removal of nearly all restrictions of the original programming, customized objects and enemies, new powerups, you name it. |
But with that level of hacking, why not develop a new game engine from the ground up to bootstrap the code away from Nintendo's copyrighted codebase, as was done during the early stages of the LAME project?
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