#76735 - Slosha - Fri Mar 24, 2006 2:25 am
http://www.gamespot.com/news/6146526.html
I CANT WAIT!!!!!! (watch the trailker at bottom)
#76737 - ultrablade - Fri Mar 24, 2006 2:46 am
Wow! Good find! But... is this in the right section???
lol
ultrablADe
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#76744 - M3d10n - Fri Mar 24, 2006 4:05 am
Looks interesting. Seems chibi-Link is back in his full 3D cel-shaded WW glory, and I like that.
Oddly, I remember discussing with a friend months ago, when ninty confirmed a DS Zelda was on the way, about using the touch screen for boomerang control. Turns out much like what we were expecting.
I just found the in-dungeon graphics very poor, at least in the trailler. The outdoor areas looked much better (that scene in a field with a tree looked almost like a real-time 3D version of Minish Cap visual style), but the trailler dungeon looks made out of cubes with bland overly-tiled textures and no attemp at portraing some basic lighting and mood found in Minish Cap.
Who's developing this? Capcom, or a Nintendo internal dev team?
#76749 - Slosha - Fri Mar 24, 2006 5:35 am
yah... and it doesn't really help much since the bottom screen isn't supposed to be used for really good graphics (i think) but Zelda uses the bottom for actaul gameplay... I'm not sure if im right in saying this though....
#76751 - ghazi - Fri Mar 24, 2006 6:12 am
I know what you're saying Slosha. On many Nintendoods, the top screen is visually clearer than the bottom (I think this is supposed to be because of the "antiscratch" coating).
But, if you look closely, they're guiding Link around with the stylus! Watch the little fairy that leads him! =D
I'm very excited!
#76757 - Togmannen - Fri Mar 24, 2006 8:28 am
| M3d10n wrote: |
Who's developing this? Capcom, or a Nintendo internal dev team? |
Its the same team who create Wind Waker, so its Nintendo.
#76758 - Snowy? - Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:14 am
http://ds.ign.com/articles/697/697930p1.html
No need to sign-up to see the video on the IGN.com site
#76761 - MaHe - Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:03 pm
There will be a demo on E3 ... Will anyone be there an cap it?
#76768 - Darkflame - Fri Mar 24, 2006 3:31 pm
Personaly, I think it looks fantastic
Zelda + Another Code = Me happy :)
I just hope they got some four-sword goodness in there.
#76771 - genfish - Fri Mar 24, 2006 4:32 pm
im a right zelda buff, i cant wait!!!
btw whats everyones favourite zelda game? I loved ocarina of time
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#76781 - tssf - Fri Mar 24, 2006 7:51 pm
The dungeons look horribly basic, otherwise it lookes like a very interesting Zelda game.
I'm glad Nintendo is giving us reasons not to regret our purchase of the Nintendo DS. I know back in December 2004, I was having my doubts. Not anymore.
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#76784 - Dark Knight ez - Fri Mar 24, 2006 7:56 pm
Same here. I'm looking forward to 3 games for the DS:
Metroid Prime Hunters, Tales of the Tempest and this Zelda DS.
Was already worried that they might have ditched the Zelda for the DS project, since not much information was released on it, especially lately.
#76785 - swimgod - Fri Mar 24, 2006 8:03 pm
| Dark Knight ez wrote: |
Same here. I'm looking forward to 3 games for the DS:
Metroid Prime Hunters, Tales of the Tempest and this Zelda DS.
Was already worried that they might have ditched the Zelda for the DS project, since not much information was released on it, especially lately. |
you know 2 of your 'wait' games came out :D
MP:H and tetris came out on the 20th
:D
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#76796 - HyperHacker - Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:16 pm
Wow, I'm at a loss for words here. Except maybe "what the hell?". The video refuses to play, but by the sounds of it it's another case of "let's take some gimmicky new idea and apply it to Zelda so people will buy it even if it flops". Guiding characters and weapons with a stylus... OK, and how do we press buttons on both sides of the system while doing this with only 2 hands? And again with the cel shading. What is it with Nintendo and just plain refusing to push their systems' graphic abilities anywhere close to capacity? Are their graphic artists just overworked or lazy or what? The only real advantage cel shading provides over spoogetastic realistic graphics is being able to have really nice special effects, and Wind Waker was a very nice demonstration of how to not use this advantage. (It had a few nice ones, but most of them were just eww.)
OK I guess this sounds like your ordinary "wah wah cel shading sux" rant, so let's ignore that for now. WW's cel shading was the smallest reason out of quite a few I didn't like the game. Above it were poor level design (way too much sailing, "puzzles" based purely on luck, total lack of suspense), bad controls (like what the hell was with that music system requiring precise timing), and some of the dumber features of the game engine (Link's suddenly lost the ability to swim for more than a minute, wtf?). This looks like it's going to be WW on two screens.
Prove me wrong, please. I loved Zelda, Link to the Past, and Link's Awakening, Ocarina of Time practically made me orgasm, and Majora's Mask wasn't all that bad (and all the others, I have yet to obtain a copy of). WW was the first Zelda game I didn't enjoy. Hopefully it can be the last too.
#76824 - Critical_Impact - Sat Mar 25, 2006 12:34 am
I reckon they should have just made a game like Ocarina of Time for DS, i totally would have loved that. They ported Mario 64, why cant they port OOT? I'd be totally awesome
#76828 - m2pt5 - Sat Mar 25, 2006 2:25 am
| Critical_Impact wrote: |
| I reckon they should have just made a game like Ocarina of Time for DS, i totally would have loved that. They ported Mario 64, why cant they port OOT? I'd be totally awesome |
Just what I'd want; to be able to hear "HEY, LISTEN!" on the go. </sarcasm>
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#76830 - Darkflame - Sat Mar 25, 2006 2:47 am
Maybe because we have already completed ocarina, and can do it again whenever we like in both regular and master quest modes?
Cubes are dirt cheap.
Pointless having yet another version, give me a new game any day :)
| Quote: |
| The video refuses to play...blahblah blah |
Then dont comment.
#76837 - thetree222 - Sat Mar 25, 2006 5:33 am
I've got two things two say:
1. another reason for the cel graphics is this: look at resident evil DS and Goldeneye DS, they went for the "real" look, and in the end, they're only OK. now, with the cel graphics, you get a sweet looking game, no crap added.
2. no matter what it looks like, zelda is zelda, except for zeldaII and those super crap CD-i games.
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#76846 - tssf - Sat Mar 25, 2006 9:58 am
| swimgod wrote: |
| Dark Knight ez wrote: | Same here. I'm looking forward to 3 games for the DS:
Metroid Prime Hunters, Tales of the Tempest and this Zelda DS.
Was already worried that they might have ditched the Zelda for the DS project, since not much information was released on it, especially lately. |
you know 2 of your 'wait' games came out :D
MP:H and tetris came out on the 20th
:D |
Tales of Tempest is not Tetris DS. ;)
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#76850 - Dark Knight ez - Sat Mar 25, 2006 11:02 am
Plus I live in Europe. Metroid Prime Hunters is not released here yet, I believe.
#76867 - The 9th Sage - Sat Mar 25, 2006 4:34 pm
| tssf wrote: |
Tales of Tempest is not Tetris DS. ;) |
Heh, I got all excited for a second there..."Whoa, Tales of Tempest is out already? O_o" then I realized he was confusing it with Tetris DS. :P
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#76872 - tepples - Sat Mar 25, 2006 5:59 pm
How are they going to mix the Tales RPG series with a vector based arcade shooter from 1980?
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#76875 - thetree222 - Sat Mar 25, 2006 6:24 pm
with magic, of course...
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#76894 - HyperHacker - Sat Mar 25, 2006 11:03 pm
| Darkflame wrote: |
Maybe because we have already completed ocarina, and can do it again whenever we like in both regular and master quest modes?
Cubes are dirt cheap.
Pointless having yet another version, give me a new game any day :)
| Quote: | | The video refuses to play...blahblah blah |
Then dont comment. |
You're right, I should hold off making an opinion until I've seen more... I just really really don't like Cel-shaded Zelda. It looks nice in some cases, but it just doesn't fit the feel the games create. (And IMO, WW didn't implement it so well.) And by the look of it it looks like it's going to be a lot like WW, which as I stated, I really didn't enjoy.
How does the drawing-things-while-playing work anyway? Do you like stop to draw something, or just use the stylus instead of the d-pad, or something weird? I guess if they could make a 'guide the character using the stylus' mechanism that doesn't suck (and I'm sure they could) you could use the d-pad as A/B/X/Y, so you can write with your right hand. Interesting idea there...
Honestly though, I'd love an OoT port. I've been meaning to play through it again, but I don't often play console games, simply because I have to set everything up, sit in a few specific not-very-comfortable positions (I need a recliner <_<), etc. A portable version would be just the push I need to actually do it.
And even though it'll never happen, DS having the expansion (GBA) slot, cheap medium, and wifi makes it perfect to release all the 64DD stuff they never released on N64. Oh, if only...
#76905 - M3d10n - Sun Mar 26, 2006 2:39 am
Geez, so much cell-shading hate. You're putting down the game too much just because it might look cartooney. If it bothers you so much, how could you stand A Link To The Past?
Well, I suppose you managed to watch the vieo already, since it's avaliable in at least 3 different formats all over the web, but I'll describe
The game looks a lot like Minish Cap, but using 3D graphics instead of 2D (but again, Minish Cap is a bit based on WW). It uses a top down perspective, slightly tilted down (much like Trace Memory/Another Code), and Link moves around like in any 2D Zelda, without need to lock-on nor camera adjustements.
It looks like Navi acts as a cursor, and she goes wherever you touch the screen. You can control Link himself like this, again in a way that resembles Trace Memory/Another Code.
Looks like you simply tap nearby enemies with the stylus to attack, so there's no need to use any buttons at all in stylus control mode (and a d-pad+buttons seems totally possible). Seems that it's possible to switching items, opening the inventory and acessing the map all using the touch screen, so they're working into making it possible to play the whole thing without having to switch to the buttons.
I'm looking forward this game, if only because the preliminar touch controls show lots of potential, if done right.
It's being done by the WW team, so WW haters run away in disgust as they want. At least their director openly admited WW was flawed in interviews, admiting their own mistakes. That's one step into correcting problems and creating a better product.
#76909 - Sebbo - Sun Mar 26, 2006 3:55 am
my only grudge with wind waker was that it was too short...sure the graphics are cartoony, but it allowed many effects you wouldn't have gotten with a photorealistic engine (water dripping from link, footprints in the sand, the small gusts of wind etc). the reason for having link not be able to swim forever is because if you could swim forever, you'd have people/idiots swimming from island to island
back to zelda ds.... anyone think that this could possibly be the sequel to WW that was promised? going from the steam boat in the trailer i think it might be possible
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#76910 - tepples - Sun Mar 26, 2006 4:16 am
| M3d10n wrote: |
| Geez, so much cell-shading hate. You're putting down the game too much just because it might look cartooney. If it bothers you so much, how could you stand A Link To The Past? |
People tolerated cartoon because cartoon was the style that looked good on Super NES before Donkey Kong Country demonstrated how to squeeze relatively photorealistic graphics into 16-color sprites.
| Quote: |
It looks like Navi acts as a cursor, and she goes wherever you touch the screen. You can control Link himself like this, again in a way that resembles Trace Memory/Another Code.
Looks like you simply tap nearby enemies with the stylus to attack, so there's no need to use any buttons at all in stylus control mode |
Isn't that how Diablo works?
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#76911 - Mr. Picklesworth - Sun Mar 26, 2006 4:54 am
This looks good.
I like the graphics in here. They managed to make something that stands out a bit without straining the system's limited hardware.
I'm excited, now!
I was looking forward to something sort of like the N64 version, though. Oh, well...
Further reason why they should have done the full 3d thing with Mario64 DS layout is because, as said earlier, the bottom scren Should Not be used for pretty graphics. It doesn't look quite as nice as the top one anyway, and for many people, it has many marks from the stylus, so it looks even less crisp. Since they have heavy stylus use, the gameplay may encounter problems when the player can't see what they are doing.
Besides... this looks like a perspective view camera, does it not?
So why can't they have all the Diabloish stuff going on with the map on the bottom screen, while drawing all the fancy 3d stuff on the top?
Doesn't make sense to me...
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#76913 - knight0fdragon - Sun Mar 26, 2006 5:02 am
didnt mortal kombat come out be4 donkey kong
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#76918 - Griffzane - Sun Mar 26, 2006 7:37 am
whats with nintendo and them not push the capabilities of their systems? this game could look soo much better...
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#76925 - Mr. Picklesworth - Sun Mar 26, 2006 7:59 am
| Griffzane wrote: |
| whats with nintendo and them not push the capabilities of their systems? this game could look soo much better... |
Because when they do that, this happens:
http://ds.ign.com/objects/729/729102.html
Woohoo! Passable :)
Heh... I couldn't find anything worse, oddly enough. Anyway, you probably get my point. We've all seen what happens with games that push their platform too hard.
60 Frames / Second and sharp, smooth, unachieving graphics are far superior to 20 FPS jagged, mucky, and relatively spectacular (but realistically awful) graphics.
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#76952 - HyperHacker - Sun Mar 26, 2006 8:42 pm
| M3d10n wrote: |
| Geez, so much cell-shading hate. You're putting down the game too much just because it might look cartooney. If it bothers you so much, how could you stand A Link To The Past? |
For making absolutely no sense, I'm surprised how common this argument is. LTTP was a SNES game. It had a top-down view and the characters were 16x16 pixels. Most of the graphics were in fact very detailed, and quite realistic for a SNES game. The only thing that really looked like WW at all was Link, and he was just too small to notice it. Compared to WW, where Link is a large 3D model, and the game is running on a Gamecube, it's quite a difference. A SNES game that looks like it's running on a SNES is fine. A Gamecube game that looks like it's running on a SNES (save for being 3D) is different. Cel shading works in 2D and in silly games. Zelda doesn't have that 'silly' feeling to it.
Honestly I didn't think LTTP looked even remotely similar to WW. It's actually pretty realistic for a SNES game.
#76957 - olimar - Sun Mar 26, 2006 10:00 pm
Last edited by olimar on Wed Aug 20, 2008 10:20 pm; edited 3 times in total
#76958 - thetree222 - Sun Mar 26, 2006 10:03 pm
if you don't like it, don't buy it you stupid id10ts... besides zelda is zelda, and i, along with many other people, will buy it, because those graphics may not be realistic, but they're still really sweet. i can't wait to play it, i know that, who's with me?
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#76988 - The 9th Sage - Mon Mar 27, 2006 4:36 am
| HyperHacker wrote: |
(snip)...makes it perfect to release all the 64DD stuff they never released on N64. Oh, if only... |
Isn't that what Master Quest was?
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#76998 - CubeGuy - Mon Mar 27, 2006 8:33 am
Yes it was, but we never got the rest of Master Quest either. There was supposed to be a whole 'nother overworld to explore.
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#77006 - Darkflame - Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:25 pm
That bit might have become Majoras Mask, or the Ocarina "Add on" that it had hocks for.
(Master Quest was not the add-on)
| Quote: |
| For making absolutely no sense, I'm surprised how common this argument is. LTTP was a SNES game. It had a top-down view and the characters were 16x16 pixels. Most of the graphics were in fact very detailed, and quite realistic for a SNES game |
I think when people say that they are more refering to the enemys and such were all cartoon like.
eg. Gannon was a Pig.
The main good news about this game, imo, is that they fixed the main problem with Wind Waker; The long borring sailing bits.
This time you draw a course, it automaticaly takes it, while you can controll the ships cannon (effectively an on-rails shotter)
| Quote: |
It's being done by the WW team, so WW haters run away in disgust as they want. At least their director openly admited WW was flawed in interviews, admiting their own mistakes. That's one step into correcting problems and creating a better product. |
Wind Waker Team = Twilight Princess team, as well, for that mater :p
I assume different memebers are working on different bits, but its the same effective group at Nintendo doing both.
Wonder if theres any chance of a wireless revolution link up?
[/optimistic]
#77009 - knight0fdragon - Mon Mar 27, 2006 1:06 pm
| HyperHacker wrote: |
| M3d10n wrote: | | Geez, so much cell-shading hate. You're putting down the game too much just because it might look cartooney. If it bothers you so much, how could you stand A Link To The Past? |
For making absolutely no sense, I'm surprised how common this argument is. LTTP was a SNES game. It had a top-down view and the characters were 16x16 pixels. Most of the graphics were in fact very detailed, and quite realistic for a SNES game. The only thing that really looked like WW at all was Link, and he was just too small to notice it. Compared to WW, where Link is a large 3D model, and the game is running on a Gamecube, it's quite a difference. A SNES game that looks like it's running on a SNES is fine. A Gamecube game that looks like it's running on a SNES (save for being 3D) is different. Cel shading works in 2D and in silly games. Zelda doesn't have that 'silly' feeling to it.
Honestly I didn't think LTTP looked even remotely similar to WW. It's actually pretty realistic for a SNES game. |
I find this great, wheres the bitching about 4 swords??? was that not a GC game with SNES gfx, yet no biching about that, you know if you want things to just look good, just stick with the movie scene, I prefer to PLAY my games, and the only thing that was a hassle with WW was the long boat rides, but that just goes to show u that u need to pay attention in the games to get that warping song, other then that it had everything zelda was, Puzzles, annoying enemies, secrets, twisting plot, and some mediocre comedy to it.
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#77011 - Sebbo - Mon Mar 27, 2006 1:43 pm
four swords actually started as a multiplayer bonus that was on the same cart as ALTTP on GBA, they just "ported" it to GC later
i didn't mind the long boat rides too much...gives you a couple of minutes for a toilet break or to get some food without pausing
i kinda said it in my last post, but in regards to WW, although the graphics were cartoony, the actual game engine and effects they could pull off with it were very nice, and i don't think many would have been possible with a more demanding graphics style
either way, i'll be getting the game no matter how it plays...after all, its not how good it looks, but how good it plays (looks sometimes help tho)
and am i the only one who thinks this might be the direct sequel to WW?
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#77028 - Dudu.exe - Mon Mar 27, 2006 4:15 pm
Too bad if you dont like Cell-shaded .. i love it.. and i allways see Zelda as a cartoon ... and WW is fantastics.. i love it..
i really dont know why so much hate with cell-shade..
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#77031 - Mr. Picklesworth - Mon Mar 27, 2006 4:27 pm
I agree, it's a shame that they cell-shaded Wind Waker. The first screenshots of that game, before they cell-shaded it, were fantastic!
It was too much of a change from the feel that they were achieving with the N64 version.
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#77033 - Darkflame - Mon Mar 27, 2006 4:50 pm
| Quote: |
| four swords actually started as a multiplayer bonus that was on the same cart as ALTTP on GBA, they just "ported" it to GC later |
Wasnt a port, it merely used the same concepts.
| Quote: |
and am i the only one who thinks this might be the direct sequel to WW? |
Nope.
I am sure thats outset island in the trailer.
#77073 - Griffzane - Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:43 am
this is kind of off topic, but any news on Twilight Princess? when is it going to be released?
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#77087 - Darkflame - Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:54 am
| Griffzane wrote: |
| this is kind of off topic, but any news on Twilight Princess? when is it going to be released? |
Rumours point to November, alongside the revolution.
It will still be a cube game, but its revolution features will be substantial enough for them to market it as both.
#77091 - The 9th Sage - Tue Mar 28, 2006 4:45 am
| Darkflame wrote: |
That bit might have become Majoras Mask, or the Ocarina "Add on" that it had hocks for.
(Master Quest was not the add-on) |
I'm pretty sure Master Quest was the add-on. All it was ever supposed to be I think was a remix of the game. I remember Ura Zelda being described as a disk add-on that pulled assets from the game cartridge (minimizing load times), I really don't think it was supposed to be an all-new game. I must have seen that in a Nintendo Power, it was years ago though so I'm not certain.
Although, actually, it is possible they originally planned to 'remix' the overworld too, in a Zelda 1 Second Quest kind of way like they did with the dungeons. Anyway, no way of knowing for sure now at this point. :) Also, since I"m talking about it, I'd guess that if it was possible to load a new 'quest data' for the game like that, that maybe that's why that so called 'beta quest' code exists.
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#77102 - HyperHacker - Tue Mar 28, 2006 7:38 am
The "Beta Quest" code is more of a "screw up level and cutscene loading" code. All it really does is scramble level exits and make cutscenes not work right. You can access beta stuff in it, but the effect it produces isn't beta itself, just a really neat glitch.
Now, the code that adds a disk icon next to the files on the file select...
| olimar wrote: |
| I'm confused. First cel shading is bad because it's not pushing the hardware. Then WW was bad because of poor game design (what does that have to do with this new game?) Then cel shading is bad because it makes games silly/cute, and Zelda should be more serious, I guess. Pick an argument and stick with it, eh? |
There is only one argument here. Cel shading is too cute for Zelda and demonstrates Nintendo's fear of pushing the hardware *ahem*SuperMarioWorld*ahem*. I only mentioned the bad game design to clarify that graphics weren't the reason I didn't like WW.
| The 9th Sage wrote: |
| HyperHacker wrote: |
(snip)...makes it perfect to release all the 64DD stuff they never released on N64. Oh, if only... |
Isn't that what Master Quest was? |
Nah, just the original OoT levels shuffled a bit. Maybe some of it was unreleased, but there was far more.
| knight0fdragon wrote: |
| wheres the bitching about 4 swords??? was that not a GC game with SNES gfx, yet no biching about that |
4 Swords was designed to display the same thing on both the TV and a GBA at the same time, of course it had to have SNES-like graphics.
| Quote: |
| the only thing that was a hassle with WW was the long boat rides |
Well I just plain disagree here. I found the really annoying enemies, puzzles based entirely on luck, level design and controls all to be quite a hassle.
| Mr. Picklesworth wrote: |
I agree, it's a shame that they cell-shaded Wind Waker. The first screenshots of that game, before they cell-shaded it, were fantastic!
It was too much of a change from the feel that they were achieving with the N64 version. |
Exactly. The N64 version looked awesome, the early screenshots and videos were just HOLY CRAP, and then they did a complete 180. That was probably the biggest problem, really. Not that they cel-shaded it, but that they showed incredible realistic graphics and THEN cel-shaded it.
#77127 - Darkflame - Tue Mar 28, 2006 2:47 pm
| Quote: |
Well I just plain disagree here. I found the really annoying enemies, puzzles based entirely on luck, level design and controls all to be quite a hassle.
|
The controlls were identical to Ocarina, and there was no puzzles based on luck :-/
(heck, there wasnt that many puzzles...)
| Quote: |
| There is only one argument here. Cel shading is too cute for Zelda and demonstrates Nintendo's fear of pushing the hardware *ahem*SuperMarioWorld*ahem*. |
Its nothing about "fear of pushing the system" (Metroid Hunters).
Its just the style they have chosen, some of us like it, you dont.
That's all there is too it.
Also, while Wind Waker was cute, cell shadeing certainly dosnt make things look cute (Killer7), thats purely art style.
Not to mention the fact that cell-shading really doesnt make stuff that much easier from a hardware point of view, other then saving ram.
Also, Mario World really did push the hardware, MarioWorld didn't have any chips in the cart other then the code remember.
| Quote: |
| I'm pretty sure Master Quest was the add-on. All it was ever supposed to be I think was a remix of the game. I remember Ura Zelda being described as a disk add-on that pulled assets from the game cartridge (minimizing load times), I really don't think it was supposed to be an all-new game. I must have seen that in a Nintendo Power, it was years ago though so I'm not certain. |
Not a new game, but an extension rather then a remix.
Think of the "lost levels" kinda thing.
New stuff, but using mostly the same assets. (in terms of models, textures and code)
My own theory is that the guy you race but cant beat is a hint/leftover of what would have been a connection between the addon and the original.
| Quote: |
The first screenshots of that game, before they cell-shaded it, were fantastic!
|
Gamecube tech demo
#77178 - The 9th Sage - Tue Mar 28, 2006 10:34 pm
| HyperHacker wrote: |
The "Beta Quest" code is more of a "screw up level and cutscene loading" code. All it really does is scramble level exits and make cutscenes not work right. You can access beta stuff in it, but the effect it produces isn't beta itself, just a really neat glitch.
Now, the code that adds a disk icon next to the files on the file select... |
Well yeah, I know it's technically not a 'hey, this is the beta version!' code like some people say. :) I never got that disk icon code to work, but if you look around you can find stuff like 64DD disk error messages and stuff which is kind of interesting.
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#77187 - Darkflame - Wed Mar 29, 2006 3:13 am
yeah, theres certainly traces of the "hocks" in there.
Shame the 64DD didnt catch on. It had lots of neat ideas planned for it. (editing textures in any game with mario artist, for instance).
Not to mention I always wanted that F-Zero track editor :p
#77198 - HyperHacker - Wed Mar 29, 2006 7:28 am
I think the code only works on V1.0. Might not even be typed correctly. I did see a disk once though. :-p
| Darkflame wrote: |
| Quote: | Well I just plain disagree here. I found the really annoying enemies, puzzles based entirely on luck, level design and controls all to be quite a hassle.
|
The controlls were identical to Ocarina, and there was no puzzles based on luck :-/
(heck, there wasnt that many puzzles...) |
Maybe "physics" would have been a better word here, though there were a few control things that drove me nuts (using the C stick as buttons, especially to play music with). As for puzzles, I played up to the fire dungeon and every puzzle I came across seemed to just be "run over here, do this, run back here, do this, and pray" over and over and over until it finally worked.
| Quote: |
| Also, while Wind Waker was cute, cell shadeing certainly dosnt make things look cute (Killer7), thats purely art style. |
Depends on the colours.
| Quote: |
| Not to mention the fact that cell-shading really doesnt make stuff that much easier from a hardware point of view, other then saving ram. |
Less polygons, at least in WW's case.
| Quote: |
| Also, Mario World really did push the hardware, MarioWorld didn't have any chips in the cart other then the code remember. |
Are you kidding? The original SMW looks like crap compared to what some hacks have:
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These hacks use 4BPP graphics rather than the 3BPP Nintendo used. True that means using more ROM space, but I doubt they couldn't have squeezed it in. There's also plenty of Super Mario Bros hacks that have way better graphics than the original without having any effect on ROM size, memory consumption or game performance. Nintendo just used really simple graphics for no apparent reason. And they do this almost every time!
#77212 - Materialist - Wed Mar 29, 2006 11:53 am
1. Theyre not doing anything without a reason... thats no japanese philosophie its western.
2. There 2 kinds of ways to immerse in a game. One is through "reality" graphics, that btw arent like reality whatsoever, and physic simulations, those arent like reality neither. The hardware is simply not powerful enough, best thing they can do is still comic-like.
The second one is through your imagination and phantasie, which is quite powerful because it is nearly limitless. But today where the kids of the 80s and 90s grew up and gave the flame of "read 3 books at all" to the next gen, a couple of people dont even understand the pure concept of high detailed graphics in your head and not on the screen anymore.
I wont say that neither the one nor the other ist the better way.
It is simply not possible to compare those ways on the same level.
As Hitchcock said, "...nothing is as scary a a closed door." You can have all the finest textures and physics you want in your imagination.
It was enough to you when you where young and played with action dolls or matchbox cars... those arent "realistic" in anyway but you loved them because they became real in your head.
If better and better effects are needed to let you slip into a game universe you should think about where you are going...
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#77233 - The 9th Sage - Wed Mar 29, 2006 6:15 pm
| HyperHacker wrote: |
| Not to mention the fact that cell-shading really doesnt make stuff that much easier from a hardware point of view, other then saving ram. |
Less polygons, at least in WW's case.
[/quote]
Does it? I can't say noticed, if it does. What I did notice was the positive aspects of the game's art style, such as the smooth detailed animation. ;)
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#77238 - Sausage Boy - Wed Mar 29, 2006 6:36 pm
HyperHacker, I don't think those hacks look much better than the game really. Some of them feel really wierd, not at all the smooth feeling I experienced in the game.
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#77272 - Darkflame - Wed Mar 29, 2006 10:22 pm
Yeah, Id say those hacks look mostly worse :-/
If you havnt got the colours to do smooth gradients, dont try is what I say :p
And so what if people can make the background ripple..theres plenty of rippling in mario, Nintendo knew how to do it, but they didnt do it for the background because it was pointless.
Nintendo wanted a smooth consistant style for Mario World, and they did it.
None of those hacks help the game.
If Nintendo built a game from the ground up to have more detail, they would do it with a style in mind; aka Yoshi's island.
| Quote: |
Less polygons, at least in WW's case.
|
umm...I don't think I believe this.
The edges in TWW where very very smooth.
In fact, low polygons are highlighted even worse in cellshadeing because you get a Jared gradient of light/dark rather then a smooth one.
| Quote: |
| but I doubt they couldn't have squeezed it in. |
Mario World was a release day game, it probably was an extreamly tight squeeze already.
Remember, in these days space was always a premium.
You can look to stuff like Yoshi's Island to see more advanced nintendo platforming graphics.
Nintendo push graphics all the time for their systems specs.
What they dont push is realism.
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