#79120 - zzo38computer - Tue Apr 11, 2006 7:43 pm
There is PassMe, PassMe2, WifiMe, and a few other things that are ideas and haven't been completely invented yet, such as WifiMe2, JamMe, PetMe, NoPass, etc.
Here are some other ideas:
SwapMe
You would have a device that you can put 2 cards in, then put that in the slot. When one licenced software start running, you can put a switch which enabled access to the other inserted card, which has unlicensed software in it. If it tries to read that card, it can run unlicensed software from it.
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#79128 - tepples - Tue Apr 11, 2006 7:59 pm
It wouldn't just be a matter of cutting power to one card and enabling power to the other card. The Nintendo DS expects to stay in sync with the card's crypto-processors. How would you ensure that both cards' crypto-processors are kept in a state that can communicate with the DS card interface?
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#79134 - Dan2552 - Tue Apr 11, 2006 8:27 pm
magic?
I had a crazy idea earlier, can't be bothered to make a new topic...
press the DS button with the touchscreen while pressing GBA at exactly the right time with the A button...
Well, if i did get it working :p i couldn't really tell
#79212 - zzo38computer - Wed Apr 12, 2006 4:32 am
I think the card-encryption (but not the RSA encryption) has been cracked. You can maybe have a device read the communications from one card and use that key when communicating with the second card (which could be a different type of card that doesn't require a key) and the DS unit.
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#79222 - josath - Wed Apr 12, 2006 6:34 am
Why make things so complicated? I don't think it would even work that way...if the DS was expecting to recieve encrypted data, and it recieved unencrypted data, it would most likely not work.
How about this:
Make a DS cart which looks like a standard DS cart to the ds, encryption and everything (as you pointed out, it has been cracked for some time now), exept it's a re-writeable ROM (these are called things like 'flash rom'). Then maybe some kind of connector to the PC, say USB, that lets you program your own .nds file into the rom.
#79232 - juhees - Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:20 am
| josath wrote: |
How about this:
Make a DS cart which looks like a standard DS cart to the ds, encryption and everything (as you pointed out, it has been cracked for some time now), exept it's a re-writeable ROM (these are called things like 'flash rom'). Then maybe some kind of connector to the PC, say USB, that lets you program your own .nds file into the rom. |
You could even add a mini SD slot to it or even SD, don't know if you can get the rest of the card small enough.
BUT: You ROM wouldn't be signed by Nintendos key, so you would still have to flash your DS. You can't run unsigned code on a notflashed DS, even if it comes from a DS card with encryption...
#79233 - chishm - Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:36 am
| juhees wrote: |
You could even add a mini SD slot to it or even SD, don't know if you can get the rest of the card small enough.
BUT: You ROM wouldn't be signed by Nintendos key, so you would still have to flash your DS. You can't run unsigned code on a notflashed DS, even if it comes from a DS card with encryption... |
DS game cards aren't signed.
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#79250 - thoduv - Wed Apr 12, 2006 1:33 pm
Yes, the two cartridge encryption have been cracker by Martin Korth.
So I wonder why it's not be possible to make an homebrew DS flash cart ...
#79251 - olimar - Wed Apr 12, 2006 1:39 pm
Last edited by olimar on Wed Aug 20, 2008 10:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
#79252 - tepples - Wed Apr 12, 2006 1:42 pm
Why hasn't anybody announced plans to implement NoPass?
- Because the entire assembly has to fit in such a small physical space.
- Because the FPGA to implement the encryption would be rawther expensive.
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#79253 - thoduv - Wed Apr 12, 2006 1:46 pm
| tepples wrote: |
Why hasn't anybody announced plans to implement NoPass?
- Because the entire assembly has to fit in such a small physical space.
- Because the FPGA to implement the encryption would be rawther expensive.
|
But Nintendo do it and DS cart aren't too much expensive ...
#79255 - tepples - Wed Apr 12, 2006 1:48 pm
Nintendo can also afford the quantities that make an ASIC cost-effective. So can Chinese manufacturers of homebrew/pirate dual use hardware, but we can't do anything about them until ninjads.com announces a ship date.
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#79257 - thoduv - Wed Apr 12, 2006 1:54 pm
So NinjaDS won't need a way to run homebrew like Magickey need ? It will be the first real DS flashcard ?
#79259 - olimar - Wed Apr 12, 2006 1:57 pm
Last edited by olimar on Wed Aug 20, 2008 10:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
#79261 - Lynx - Wed Apr 12, 2006 3:24 pm
Well, the ninjamod still looks huge (to me). I'd much rather see NoPass (which would easily fit into the DS Slot) than this thing, as most of us already have GBA media.
#79271 - zzo38computer - Wed Apr 12, 2006 4:26 pm
| josath wrote: |
Why make things so complicated? I don't think it would even work that way...if the DS was expecting to recieve encrypted data, and it recieved unencrypted data, it would most likely not work.
How about this:
Make a DS cart which looks like a standard DS cart to the ds, encryption and everything (as you pointed out, it has been cracked for some time now), exept it's a re-writeable ROM (these are called things like 'flash rom'). Then maybe some kind of connector to the PC, say USB, that lets you program your own .nds file into the rom. |
You are right about if it expects encrypted data and receives unencrypted one, it doesn't work. But my idea is a device you put 2 cards in, then it uses the key used to communicate with the first card to communicate with the DS. It reads unencrypted data from the second card and encrypts it with the first key so it will work.
Your idea won't work because even though the card communication has been cracked, the RSA hasn't. No, apparently DS cards aren't signed. If they aren't signed, then your idea is very good idea, I like this better than NINJADS. But, how I would implement it is:
There is a switch on top that says EXECUTE and WRITE. If the switch is set to WRITE, when you turn it on the display will say "Set switch to EXECUTE and turn off DS and turn it back on, then it will work." If you instead press X,Y,UP,UP,SELECT (or another combination), it will open a menu for writing to that card from: GBA slot (CF card, etc), HTTP, FTP, DS Download Play, etc.
And about NINJADS: If you can get one of those, it should (I don't know if it does) have a feature to autostart if a file such as _AUTO.NDS or _BOOT_MP.NDS exists on the SD card. (so you don't have to go through the menu every time)
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#79297 - tepples - Wed Apr 12, 2006 7:07 pm
| Lynx wrote: |
| Well, the ninjamod still looks huge (to me). I'd much rather see NoPass (which would easily fit into the DS Slot) than this thing, as most of us already have GBA media. |
M3 also looks huge to any DS lite owner.
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#79309 - JaJa - Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:13 pm
A completely enclosed DS cart size homebrew device would very very expensive.
It's probably so expensive, no one wants to develop it, because their design would just get ripped off and sold for less money (with even cheaper components).
Also the audience would be very small due to it's cost, making the device unprofitable.
#79311 - zzo38computer - Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:44 pm
| JaJa wrote: |
A completely enclosed DS cart size homebrew device would very very expensive.
It's probably so expensive, no one wants to develop it, because their design would just get ripped off and sold for less money (with even cheaper components).
Also the audience would be very small due to it's cost, making the device unprofitable. |
OK. Will making it bigger to decrease the cost in any way?
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#79329 - JaJa - Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:53 pm
Yes as you can use bigger (cheaper?) components., but then it defeats the point.
Everyone has been going on about a "NoPass" device (i.e. all in one flash cart and passme).
If you were to make it bigger, why not just stick with what we have now?
#79332 - mntorankusu - Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:18 pm
| JaJa wrote: |
Yes as you can use bigger (cheaper?) components., but then it defeats the point.
Everyone has been going on about a "NoPass" device (i.e. all in one flash cart and passme).
If you were to make it bigger, why not just stick with what we have now? |
I thought that a "NoPass" would have the same function as a PassMe, only due to its use of the DS card encryption, it would work on newer firmware without any need for SRAM or any of that nonsense. Personally, I think that would be the best solution for homebrew, since SD and CF GBA devices are super-convenient and they're already widely available.
#79337 - tepples - Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:44 pm
| JaJa wrote: |
| If you were to make it bigger, why not just stick with what we have now? |
Because I know how Nintendo could defeat PassMe2 in future firmware versions: - die if either execution address points at a return instruction (bx lr) or invalid SWI, or
- reread the card header in encrypted mode.
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#79338 - olimar - Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:56 pm
Last edited by olimar on Wed Aug 20, 2008 10:24 pm; edited 1 time in total
#79339 - mastertop101 - Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:26 am
it's just a little passme..
#79353 - mntorankusu - Thu Apr 13, 2006 2:49 am
| mastertop101 wrote: |
| it's just a little passme.. |
It's not just a little PassMe. It's a little PassMe that works on all firmwares without the need for SRAM:
| Quote: |
| According to the manufacturers, it supports all NDS consoles, direct booting, no need for flashme, DS lite support and is a pure plug and play device. |
Very nice, since I will not be eager to FlashMe a brand new DS Lite when I get one.
#79381 - Darkflame - Thu Apr 13, 2006 9:42 am
Yes, the main issue is makeing it possible for for as many people as possible to access homebrew, imo.
That means being able to use firmware, or flash, newer model DS's without using more expensive SRam devices.
#79447 - zzo38computer - Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:30 pm
I was thinking if you could make it a XW (eXecute/Write) card, then you could give the card to someone else and they can use it without any extra equipment. They won't know how to reprogram it without entering the correct sequence of buttons. If you purchase a blank one, it will come with a manual so that you can program it.
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#79549 - HyperHacker - Fri Apr 14, 2006 7:52 am
| tepples wrote: |
| JaJa wrote: | | If you were to make it bigger, why not just stick with what we have now? |
Because I know how Nintendo could defeat PassMe2 in future firmware versions |
Quiet, they'll hear! ;-)
#79580 - MaHe - Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:13 pm
Finding an exploit INSIDE a DS Download Play game could allow us an universal passthrough method and it couldn't be blocked (unless they block that game and I doubt that'd happen).
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#79598 - tepples - Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:14 pm
| MaHe wrote: |
| Finding an exploit INSIDE a DS Download Play game could allow us an universal passthrough method |
Please direct further comments about this to what has become the latest WiFiMe2 thread ;-)
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