#86874 - ethoscapade - Sat Jun 10, 2006 2:53 am
the sources to snesDS, etc. were never released, were they?
#86879 - Normmatt - Sat Jun 10, 2006 3:15 am
| ethoscapade wrote: |
| the sources to snesDS, etc. were never released, were they? |
nope, loopy and gladius are the only known people to have the sources
#86932 - gladius - Sat Jun 10, 2006 6:14 pm
| ethoscapade wrote: |
| the sources to snesDS, etc. were never released, were they? |
This is off-topic, but if you want to work on it, shoot me an e-mail.
#87021 - Darkflame - Sun Jun 11, 2006 1:54 pm
I just hope the project dosnt completely freeze just when its almost perfect, like NesDS ;)
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#87038 - Scorpei - Sun Jun 11, 2006 6:01 pm
Agreed.
I would like to see NesDS and SnesDS developed further.
Maybe this summer?
#87046 - Mrshlee - Sun Jun 11, 2006 6:53 pm
| Scorpei wrote: |
Agreed.
I would like to see NesDS and SnesDS developed further.
Maybe this summer? |
if the source is released.. maybe
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#87106 - Darkflame - Sun Jun 11, 2006 11:56 pm
NesDS just needs minor fixs and a working save, imo.
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#87138 - Normmatt - Mon Jun 12, 2006 5:35 am
| gladius wrote: |
| ethoscapade wrote: | | the sources to snesDS, etc. were never released, were they? |
This is off-topic, but if you want to work on it, shoot me an e-mail. |
this is off-topic aswell but i always wanted to know why loopy never released the sources to SnesDS as he did with SnesAdvance
#87143 - Scorpei - Mon Jun 12, 2006 6:59 am
Maybe to prevent having 60 different versions?
#87150 - gladius - Mon Jun 12, 2006 8:53 am
| Normmatt wrote: |
| This is off-topic aswell but i always wanted to know why loopy never released the sources to SnesDS as he did with SnesAdvance |
Perhaps this discussion should be moved into a different thread. Anyhow, I'm not sure what his reasoning is, but not many people have contributed to the snesadvance effort. Releasing the source to pocketspc garnered me approximately zero benefit. Of course it didn't cost me anything, and it might have helped people write sound mixers way back in the olden days, but nobody actually contributed anything to it.
I think you overestimate the number of people with the time, assembly skills and snes knowledge to work on something like this. Flubba was the only person I know of who really did any work on snesadvance (edit: other than loopy of course).
#87240 - Darkflame - Mon Jun 12, 2006 8:17 pm
Thats true, but its also true purhapes that when people dont think something can be done, little effort is made to do it.
Or when something takes a lot of effort to do, there may be 10 people who would do it, but 8 of them wont work on it if they think their work will be just duplicateing someone else's.
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#87268 - Durandle - Tue Jun 13, 2006 12:37 am
Out of interest what *did* happen to SnesDS? I was away from forums and such for a while so may have missed something, but it seemed that it was really getting to be a fully working emu and then stopped...
I am guessing that the amount of work needed was just too much, especially for a smaller homebrew scene where only 30% of people may even use it :)
#87271 - TJ - Tue Jun 13, 2006 12:42 am
Perhaps I am just an idealist...
Since when does it matter if releasing the source code of a project is going to further it's development? With open source software people have the option of helping in the development, but it certainly is not required. OSS is more about the sharing of knowledge.
Out of the millions of people that run Linux, how many of them have ever contributed anything back, 2% maybe? I've never heard anyone complain about that.
#87292 - gladius - Tue Jun 13, 2006 3:30 am
As to what happened, my guess is real life. That's certainly what happened to me :).
TJ, I agree totally, I have no problem with releasing the source to my stuff, even if nobody contributes back to it. My comment was just meant to show that releasing the source will not cause it to be worked on by 20 people all of a sudden :).
#87308 - moofree - Tue Jun 13, 2006 6:51 am
Set up a CVS :D
I predict a large increase of interest in this emulator now that the ds lite is out in america.
Of course i could be wrong... but set up a cvs anyway ;)
#87454 - fartz - Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:09 am
SnesDs and NesDs are awsomeand i for one would love to see the development start back up agein
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#87463 - ethoscapade - Wed Jun 14, 2006 1:10 am
maybe nintendo finally tracked down and executed loopy for blowing all of the security holes in their consoles wide open.
#87531 - fartz - Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:08 am
Can anyone confirm that loopy is being bothered by nintnendo? what about gladius you know?. BTW Seeing how loopy isent focussing on
snesds/Nesds any more and nintendo probley is putting pressure on him ide sugest gladius just release the snesds/Nesds source code. The sooner the better the longer they wait to release it the more people will loose intrest in working on snesds/nesds and if they release it to late no one maybe willing to work on it so ide say hurry up gladius ^_^.
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#87539 - Normmatt - Wed Jun 14, 2006 11:44 am
| fartz wrote: |
Can anyone confirm that loopy is being bothered by nintnendo? what about gladius you know?. BTW Seeing how loopy isent focussing on
snesds/Nesds any more and nintendo probley is putting pressure on him ide sugest gladius just release the snesds/Nesds source code. The sooner the better the longer they wait to release it the more people will loose intrest in working on snesds/nesds and if they release it to late no one maybe willing to work on it so ide say hurry up gladius ^_^. |
SnesDS and NesDS are both loopy's work they arent gladius' so i would assume if he was to release the sources he would have to get permission from loopy
#87557 - Lynx - Wed Jun 14, 2006 2:35 pm
Well, he could do it without permission, but it would be pretty shitty if he did release it without talking to loopy first!
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#87625 - fartz - Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:38 pm
ok gladius Snesds's fate is up to you. Relese it and you could save Snesds's development dont and its probly gonna die. I see no harm in releasing the source code because it will onley do good. If you think loopy would be fine with it then ask him first but rember man snesds's fate is up to you because loopy probly has abandoned the development of it. Its been almost a year sense last release.
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#87629 - thundrestrike - Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:10 pm
whats loopy gonna do? kill gladius after watching SnesDS advance farther?
I think he would be happy, and he just never got around to doing it
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#87645 - Dark Knight ez - Wed Jun 14, 2006 10:15 pm
| Quote: |
| Relese it and you could save Snesds's development dont and its probly gonna die. |
So, you know someone who is willing and able to code for SnesDS? I sure don't. If you do know someone, refer him or her to gladius so he or she can work on the project. Letting it become open source does _not_ mean that automaticly the amount of people who are willing and able to code for SnesDS will increase.
#87650 - thundrestrike - Wed Jun 14, 2006 10:38 pm
he has a point...
if anyone reading this has the knowledge, then please say so. You would be credited very well and everyone will be happy!
this project doesnt deserve to die x(
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#87657 - fartz - Wed Jun 14, 2006 11:00 pm
It dousent matter if i know any one who can can develope on snesds's source code. What matters is if the source code is not released it might be impossible for anyone to to ever develope on snesds ever agein. If it is released tho atleast we can say theres a chance of snesds's revival some time in the future.
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#87658 - tepples - Wed Jun 14, 2006 11:19 pm
The best chance of something happening is for someone with a decent CV on the DS to make a case to gladius, and then for gladius to make a case to loopy if possible.
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#87659 - Darkflame - Wed Jun 14, 2006 11:20 pm
Yes, to release source code doesnt mean you will suddenly get development on it, but it safeguards the possibility for the future.
That said, of course, Loopy would have to grant permission.
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#87675 - mrsaturn - Thu Jun 15, 2006 12:02 am
I agree, I'd like to see the source released.
#87682 - fartz - Thu Jun 15, 2006 12:31 am
Same here fosho gladius can you ask loopy?. thanks
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#87688 - gladius - Thu Jun 15, 2006 1:24 am
As others have said, it is not my place to release the source. Also, I have not talked with Loopy in a long while. Best bet is to be patient.
#87699 - fartz - Thu Jun 15, 2006 2:48 am
We will be patient like you say but can you plz release the source code if loopy dousent do any development on snesds in the next coming mounths. This could be all riding on you gladius because if loopy disapears and you dont release the source code its all over for Snesds and you would be letting down the hundreads of people that use Snesds and the thousands that could have used it in the future. So plz gladius atleast consider releasing it as a last resort.
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#87703 - dantheman - Thu Jun 15, 2006 3:09 am
I may be out of place here, but fartz, please stop heckling Gladius about the sourcecode. You're acting like the universe will implode if Gladius doesn't release the source, which he has already stated isn't his place to release. Enough with the "it's all riding on you" and "you're letting us all down" crap. The developers aren't getting paid for writing the emulators, and they have no obligation whatsoever to make sure their "customers" are 100% satisfied with the product.
Releasing the source may be a good idea. It may not. I really don't know. But please stop pressuring Gladius. It isn't his decision to make, and your constant pleading makes you look like an impatient fool.
I'm going to finish with a quote by Dark Knight ez that basically sums up my opinions:
| Quote: |
| So, you know someone who is willing and able to code for SnesDS? I sure don't. If you do know someone, refer him or her to gladius so he or she can work on the project. Letting it become open source does _not_ mean that automaticly the amount of people who are willing and able to code for SnesDS will increase. |
#87707 - fartz - Thu Jun 15, 2006 3:34 am
Screw it then ide put my money on Snesds going no where if the source isent released. for snesds onley its death awaits it. With Snesds its all over and this topic is pointless there will be no revival.
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#87713 - outphase - Thu Jun 15, 2006 4:12 am
so fartz... what can you do with the snesds source?
#87722 - The 9th Sage - Thu Jun 15, 2006 6:26 am
| fartz wrote: |
| Screw it then ide put my money on Snesds going no where if the source isent released. for snesds onley its death awaits it. With Snesds its all over and this topic is pointless there will be no revival. |
Even if the source is released one day, it doesn't mean that two days later the emulator will automatically become fully perfect in every way. You're going to have to wait a bit in either case I think. Stuff like this takes a lot of work.
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#87727 - Scorpei - Thu Jun 15, 2006 7:14 am
Isn't there another SNES emulator project for the DS just starting up?
I can't remember much about it (I only saw the news flashing by), but maybe the source will be usefull for that project?
as for making the source of SnesDS opensource, I do believe in opensource, it can be very usefull both ways.
But it is up to the developers, if they want to release it, hey that?s great, but if they feel it unnessesary (which kinda get's me hoping there will be some developement this summer breack or something ;) ), then that is there choice and right.
#87755 - Lynx - Thu Jun 15, 2006 3:45 pm
| Quote: |
| your constant pleading makes you look like an impatient fool. |
I would have used different words.. but.. either way.. the point is made.
And your methods only make developers not want to hassle with this stuff. Do people not realize that HOMEBREW means people have real jobs, and they do this for __FUN__? That they do it to show their skills.. or learn new ones?
Hell.. fartz, you could have single handedly been the one to kill SnesDS because the developers don't want to deal with people like you. On top of that, you could have killed hundereds.. maybe thousands of future projects because developers see your responses and realize.. Man.. Do I even want to deal with people like this? Using software that I am writing.. for FREE.. Something I do in my spare time.. and now.. I have to read stuff like this? Respond to posts like this?
Hmm... Thanks fartz.. Now we may never see an Athelon XP emulator for the DS.. :/
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#87758 - Scorpei - Thu Jun 15, 2006 3:54 pm
| Lynx wrote: |
| Quote: | | your constant pleading makes you look like an impatient fool. |
I would have used different words.. but.. either way.. the point is made.
And your methods only make developers not want to hassle with this stuff. Do people not realize that HOMEBREW means people have real jobs, and they do this for __FUN__? That they do it to show their skills.. or learn new ones?
Hell.. fartz, you could have single handedly been the one to kill SnesDS because the developers don't want to deal with people like you. On top of that, you could have killed hundereds.. maybe thousands of future projects because developers see your responses and realize.. Man.. Do I even want to deal with people like this? Using software that I am writing.. for FREE.. Something I do in my spare time.. and now.. I have to read stuff like this? Respond to posts like this?
Hmm... Thanks fartz.. Now we may never see an Athelon XP emulator for the DS.. :/ |
Now you are kindof using the same words as he did.
Either way the point is again made.
I too would like to see the source released (but that is purely becaus I like the general idea of opensource software).
That is the entire reason I release my work (sorry I don't code ;)) under the Creative commons license.
People can edit use and redistibute it all as they like (as long as they don't make any money off of it).
I can undertand farz wanting to see the source code released but the methods are somewhat...crude?
So next time farz I suggest using sligtly different arguments :).
Like lynx said people do make this in their spare time, for free.
If they want to release the source it is their choice.
And yes you can ask people to release the source if you need it or feel it would help developement of the app.
But don't try to talk people into feeling ashamed if they don't release it.
Anyway I want the scene to stay nice and people helping eachother.
Thats something I like about opensource too.
I can understand if frustration comes out though ;).
btw, and athlon emu (as in AMD)? lol
#87784 - FluBBa - Thu Jun 15, 2006 5:51 pm
The source to SNESAdvance can be download from the official homepage or from my homepage, the difference between the GBA and DS version is mostly the sound part (which is coded by Gladius). This would be a perfect starting point for coding a snes emu for the DS and now Gladius has allready ported snezziboy to the DS as well which allready is opensource.
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#87798 - Darkflame - Thu Jun 15, 2006 7:05 pm
| The 9th Sage wrote: |
| fartz wrote: | | Screw it then ide put my money on Snesds going no where if the source isent released. for snesds onley its death awaits it. With Snesds its all over and this topic is pointless there will be no revival. |
Even if the source is released one day, it doesn't mean that two days later the emulator will automatically become fully perfect in every way. You're going to have to wait a bit in either case I think. Stuff like this takes a lot of work. |
Indeed it does.
But lets assume Loopy dosnt have enough time to work on it anymore,then surely releaseing the source sooner would give more chance of someone else picking up development rather then releaseing it in 6 months or a years time?
Waiting is an absolute given, but the question is, is there anything to wait for?
I am not pressurising anyone to release the source, and I dont think fartz
was either.
Loopy is the only person that can decide if he wants the source released or not. But I think fartz was asking for someone to ask loopy.
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#87808 - Mrshlee - Thu Jun 15, 2006 7:31 pm
Has anyone just asked loopy yet?
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#87810 - HyperHacker - Thu Jun 15, 2006 7:40 pm
| Dark Knight ez wrote: |
| Quote: | | Relese it and you could save Snesds's development dont and its probly gonna die. |
So, you know someone who is willing and able to code for SnesDS? |
I'd be willing to take a stab at it. I don't really know much about SNES, but hey, a few years ago I didn't really know much about Game Boy either. ;-) I agree that if loopy doesn't show up for a month or two, we can consider him to have been executed by bounty hunters and let gladius decide whether he wants to release the source on his own.
Although if anyone wants an argument as to why the source should be released: Think about how many people chose PSP over DS because it has a working SNES emulator. :-p
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#87817 - tepples - Thu Jun 15, 2006 7:46 pm
Once somebody combines SnezziDS with gladius's existing SPC players, we may start seeing some progress.
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#87825 - Lynx - Thu Jun 15, 2006 8:05 pm
| Quote: |
Think about how many people chose PSP over DS because it has a working SNES emulator. :-p
|
Uhh... ok? I thought about it.. only thing I could come up with is... "What a bunch of dumb*sses.."
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#87832 - Dark Knight ez - Thu Jun 15, 2006 8:25 pm
| tepples wrote: |
| Once somebody combines SnezziDS with gladius's existing SPC players, we may start seeing some progress. |
Gladius already created a version with sound added. I have not yet had the chance to check it out for myself. Very promising.
#87865 - thundrestrike - Fri Jun 16, 2006 1:27 am
| Dark Knight ez wrote: |
| tepples wrote: | | Once somebody combines SnezziDS with gladius's existing SPC players, we may start seeing some progress. |
Gladius already created a version with sound added. I have not yet had the chance to check it out for myself. Very promising. |
a version of what? (sorry im not catching on in this thread, too much argument)
on a side note...
Loopy is gonna read this thread and say "what a bunch of losers"
He's gonna laugh at all the argument created over something as simple as code. Do you really think he will keep the source to himself? If he has stopped working on this, he probably will - in time - release it. Just be patient.
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#87875 - chishm - Fri Jun 16, 2006 3:57 am
There's no point begging for the source. If you are a coder capable enough to help on SnesDS, you are capable enough to write your own emulator from scratch. Case in point: Snezziboy.
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#87880 - The 9th Sage - Fri Jun 16, 2006 4:55 am
| Darkflame wrote: |
But lets assume Loopy dosnt have enough time to work on it anymore,then surely releaseing the source sooner would give more chance of someone else picking up development rather then releaseing it in 6 months or a years time? |
If he wants to release it, he'll do so when he wants to. There is no useful purpose in egging him on and trying to badger him into releasing the source. Personally I'd be thanking him for even creating the program in the first place in his spare time.
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#87891 - fartz - Fri Jun 16, 2006 9:03 am
Snesds isent all that great it can barly play most roms and is very far from compleate. Its sad to see it end its development so erly in its life time tho. It could have been somthing great.
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#87898 - Darkflame - Fri Jun 16, 2006 10:02 am
Agreed, NesDS is the one thats 99.99% perfect, imo.
Just needs saveings
| The 9th Sage wrote: |
| Darkflame wrote: |
But lets assume Loopy dosnt have enough time to work on it anymore,then surely releaseing the source sooner would give more chance of someone else picking up development rather then releaseing it in 6 months or a years time? |
If he wants to release it, he'll do so when he wants to. There is no useful purpose in egging him on and trying to badger him into releasing the source. Personally I'd be thanking him for even creating the program in the first place in his spare time. |
No one is arguing with that, I am trying to say STOP BEING SO STRESSED OUT :p
Everyone here appreciates Loopy's work, and not one person is criticizing him in any way if he cant work on it.
We are not trying to badger him, some people are simply trying to do a small polite thing called "asking".
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#87916 - outphase - Fri Jun 16, 2006 2:51 pm
| fartz wrote: |
| Snesds isent all that great it can barly play most roms and is very far from compleate. Its sad to see it end its development so erly in its life time tho. It could have been somthing great. |
You never said why YOU wanted the source so bad... if you believe you can help, you would've already worked it out with gladius.
#87930 - Dark Knight ez - Fri Jun 16, 2006 3:58 pm
| Quote: |
| a version of what? (sorry im not catching on in this thread, too much argument) |
Snezziboy ported to the DS.
Snezziboy is a newly created SNES emulator for the GBA, which is still being worked on, and Gladius ported it to the DS. That port to the DS is called SnezziDS, and now features sound as well, unlike its GBA counterpart.
http://www.forwardcoding.com/projects/snezzids/snezzids.html
#87983 - tepples - Fri Jun 16, 2006 8:25 pm
| chishm wrote: |
| There's no point begging for the source. If you are a coder capable enough to help on SnesDS, you are capable enough to write your own emulator from scratch. Case in point: Snezziboy. |
Counterpoint: PocketNES. Dwedit didn't code his own emulator from scratch, but he did add a cheat finder and a virtual memory to an existing emulator.
But before you badger anybody, look at this for a while.
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#88051 - chishm - Sat Jun 17, 2006 7:27 am
| tepples wrote: |
| chishm wrote: | | There's no point begging for the source. If you are a coder capable enough to help on SnesDS, you are capable enough to write your own emulator from scratch. Case in point: Snezziboy. |
Counterpoint: PocketNES. Dwedit didn't code his own emulator from scratch, but he did add a cheat finder and a virtual memory to an existing emulator. |
Yes, building on someone else's code makes it quicker to add new features. However, if that code isn't available in the first place then there is no worthwhile reason to beg for it.
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#88067 - Scorpei - Sat Jun 17, 2006 10:17 am
I get the feeling if anyone is interested in having the source he can just ask for it and get it sent.
That way if anyone wants to work on it he/she can and the source hasn't been fully released.
Problem kinda solved I guess.
Only counter argument I could think of is that the advantages of opensource are not fully in place (you have to really want it and have to ask for it, instead of just plucking it of the net, but hey is that so much work?).
Anyhow, snezziDS is already working quite nicely (better then SnesDS on some parts), I hope it will develope in something quite nice (should be possible, but it is always up to the coders, it is their free time of cource).
And as for NesDS I agree that it works really great and that nearly the only thing needed is a savestate.
But if anyone wants to implement it I think Loopy (and maybe Gladius, I don't really know who developed it) would gladly send him/her the source.
BTW, I asked sometime ago (I think) if developement would get going again (I don't remember who I asked, I don't have the nickname :)) and I got the answer that he had very busy and hadn't worked on nesDS and SnesDS for quite sometime.
But that if there was time (he couldn't make any promises) he might pick it up again this summer.
And like I said then, the fact that the emu's are there is already great!
The reply I got back when I asked about the status was really great and I have the utmost confidence that if you were serious in your efforts to improve snesDS you would be able to get the source.
*edit*
| chishm wrote: |
| tepples wrote: | | chishm wrote: | | There's no point begging for the source. If you are a coder capable enough to help on SnesDS, you are capable enough to write your own emulator from scratch. Case in point: Snezziboy. |
Counterpoint: PocketNES. Dwedit didn't code his own emulator from scratch, but he did add a cheat finder and a virtual memory to an existing emulator. |
Yes, building on someone else's code makes it quicker to add new features. However, if that code isn't available in the first place then there is no worthwhile reason to beg for it. |
The reason for the code isn't always used for making a new emu/updating an existing one.
One can learn from source and etc..
And as for asking, I do feel that a forum is not quite the best place to do so (unless requesting a public release), but if you need/want the source, like I said above, it is only logical to ask for it.
Of course the developer can always decide not to give the source.
That is his/her good right.
#91638 - cbutters - Sat Jul 08, 2006 2:36 pm
I met loopy in person, he let me come over to his house to borrow his passme to flash my DS LITE, he was a cool guy. I asked him about NESDS, and he said he just had no time with school and everything. I don't want to put words in his mouth, but it seemed like he had just lost interest in the project, and had lots of school to get through. (college isnt easy, especially in the field loopy is in) but maybe the DS LITE revival will put some wind in his sails though. Who knows.. i would love to see a fully functional NES emulator with SAVES. (i know about pocketnes, but the sprites are too squished on the GBA sized screen for my tastes)