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This project is discontinued! There is no need to ask whether bugs can be fixed or features can be added, until I continue the project - IF I ever will, that is.

I know about the consequences, but you can still remind me, if you need to.

I've been building an iPod-look-a-like music player for the DS. I have implemented the ClickWheel(TM) completely, and now I'll be working on the menu, and then I'll add playback of the MP3 and OGG formats.

I know that Apple won't like this. I'm thinking of making the player -skinnable- and use a different default skin. Also, I could release it with a message like: "If you like this software, buy an iPod! We LOVE APPLE!"

Download Page (wip-build, showcases the ClickWheel implementation)
It still runs on emulators right now, but will not later.
- Use touchscreen to control the ClickWheel.
- Press X to reset to bootmenu.

Enjoy, you almost have an iPod ;)
- Lick
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Last edited by Lick on Sun Jan 21, 2007 1:15 pm; edited 2 times in total

I tried it...

Menu looks very nice... I can't wait for Mp3 support ! =D
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I was even thinking of asking for a thing with the wheel thing, good work. OGG too? :) fantastic

I like the idea... :) There needs to be a better music program for the ds... I like the idea of the ipod wheel... it'd be cool if you could (eventually down the road) add support for streaming music off the net. DSOrganize does a pretty good job, but you can only do it if the bitrate is like 64 or lower...

You do some amazing work! :D
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Cool app! The scroll wheel works fine but the buttons are really hard to press. I need to press a few times to get it to register. Just be careful, we don't want you getting sued or something.

There were apps like this, but competition/cooperation can be good: iMenu, DS POD.

You guys honestly thing Apple would come after Lick for doing this? Dun think so.

SyntaxGS wrote:

You guys honestly thing Apple would come after Lick for doing this? Dun think so.

Developers of freeware tetromino games didn't think Mr. Rogers and his Tetris Company would come after them either. Nor did Avery Lee, maintainer of VirtualDub video capture and conversion software, expect a letter from Microsoft demanding removal of support for ASF.
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Well, as long as you do not advertise this on large sites, then I don't think you'll get the unwanted attention. Oh, and just a suggestion. I think it would be nice if you made the interface like Brain Age's: you hold the DS like a book.

biohazard_star wrote:

Well, as long as you do not advertise this on large sites, then I don't think you'll get the unwanted attention.

Hmm.. I can't -control- that. But I think by making the musicplayer skinnable and putting some default skin screenshots up, hopefully they won't notice that the interface is actually iPoddish.

Quote:

Oh, and just a suggestion. I think it would be nice if you made the interface like Brain Age's: you hold the DS like a book.

What would be the advantages of using it vertically?

- Lick
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Just tested out the interface on my DS-X, and I have to saw it looks great and is very stable.

Hope the big boys don't come after you.

Being skinnable would be awesome though

The problem with the Apple iPod is that is DRM. Many people will go into the Apple store and tell people which products are defective by design.

The one on Nintendo DS, if isn't DRM, then it is probably better in some ways.
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if u rename it to a relevant name that the project can continue very well
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The question we really need to ask ourselves here is:

Can Apple patent/trademark The Wheel?

Anyone taking any bets?

;-)
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change the wheel to scrolling feature then it isnt bad isit
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Please discuss further, while I post a new build.

- Added mainscreen and clickwheel-scrollable items.
- Nothing else.
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well to escape trouble you should rename the project and make a scrolling feature
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jester: Yes, the name will be changed. What kind of scrolling feature are you talking about? A simple vertical strip?

MrShlee said the wheel was actually designed by Creat!ve.. So Apple can't sue me for this.
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jester wrote:

well to escape trouble you should rename the project and make a scrolling feature

well, thats exactly what the guys working on DS Player are doing now. Tho i cant access their forum anymore so i dont know of the process but the interface looked great.

But the main features of a music player that we are lacking for the current bunch (moonshell, dsorg, etc) are playlists and equaliser.

But actually i had another idea. You know when u listen to music on winamp right? You get to install lyric plugins right? And everytime you change song, the lyrics for that song would be displayed bcoz the plugin connects to the database contributed by users and etc.

Is there by any chance this could be implemented thru wifi with a similar concept to DSLiveWeather (which gets info from www.weather.com) by using a current winamp plugin such as Leo's Lyrics's database for example?

I mean, you could use bottom screen for scrolling and stuff and the top screen for displaying tracks and when u press a button, it will toggle between playlist and lyrics. that would be neat.

I might sound a little far fetch here but it would be nice anyway. Some other nice programs such as Patrinator's DSAmp (control winamp from DS) are also very nice but i have not heard anything about it since the first release.

Perhaps i dream too much. Afterall, im just a fussy user that has not contributed anything to the scene anyway.

hey lick! i checked it and looks cool!!! great even!
one request: PLEASE add an equalizer! :D

yeah add a vertical strip Lick for the scrolling
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I dunno...

A Last.FM plugin for the DS might be fun :-)
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You can find my NDS homebrew projects here...

I usually automatically agree with portrait mode (book-style) positioning, but I have to agree with Lick: What's the purpose? I'd much rather spin on the bottom and watch the top for filebrowsing than have it sideways and be obscuring my view.

Swap screens would be nice for times when the wheel's awkward or if you just don't feel like it - clickable file listings like with Moonshell.

And, of course, your brightness/reset code.. don't know why more devs haven't thrown that in, I love it in DSLiveWeather.

Back to the pod interface, I like it in hardware, and it's similar onscreen, but more interface options (like quick buttons for 5,10,30 sec skips, or something) would be handy too.

Yeah, good question. What are iPod characteristics that should NOT be 'imitated' and could be improved?

Thanks everyone for your suggestions!
- Lick

P.S. I'll keep these ideas for the future. Still have to get the basic functionality in, first.
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I think the interface looks great.

I don't think you should dismiss your idea for a clickwheel and go for a regular scrolling bar, every other player has a scrolling bar, your project is unique in that it has a clickwheel.

Don't worry about lawsuits, as long as you don't give away personal details and only refer to yourself with your alias, Lick, there is no way to file a lawsuit against you, don't be intimidated into giving up your original idea, this is homebrew, we can't be bother with legality :)

But I do think your idea to make it skinable with a default skin that will look nothing like the iPOD, and a separate download of a custom skin with the iPOD design is a good idea, it can even be created by an anonymous user, so nobody can touch you.

To add to the feature requests:

- Lyrics, already been said but I want to add my support, I think they should appear one line at a time on top of the regular interface, so you don't have to press a certain button to toggle to lyrics mode, it should just detect when lyrics are available and show only the current line.

- Something that is very lacking in Moonshell: Random play across all folders, I'd like to be able to store my OGG files in folders inside my Music folder in the root, each band will have a folder of its own and its songs will go there, but I would like to be able to random play from all of the folders inside Music, and not just from inside the currently selected folder.

- Another idea would be to be able to put a JPG file in each band's folder with a photo of the band, or, if divided by albums, the cover art of the album. and the player will show it on the upper screen along with the lyrics (if available).

- BassBoost, I don't know if the DS hardware can play deep bass sounds, but if used with headphones it would be great to be able to enhance the bass, I like to listen to my music with full bass.

Thank you very much for your efforts, the program is shaping up very nicely.

Good luck!

Lick wrote:

Yeah, good question. What are iPod characteristics that should NOT be 'imitated' and could be improved?

Thanks everyone for your suggestions!
- Lick

P.S. I'll keep these ideas for the future. Still have to get the basic functionality in, first.

I think it'd be nice if the main menu was just folders you could make, in a directory on your card... ex:
Drive Letter:\This Programs Name\Files\Put Folders here which would be the main menu

Then you can make it the way an ipod is (which would be default), or you could change, add, and delete folders ;)

Just make settings by default as the last item in the main menu (so if you click on a folder, settings won't be there any longer ;))
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I beleive the worst that could happen to you, is receiving an email from Apple and you'd need to change some things about your player. And personnaly, if Apple did this to me, I'd be proud of it.

zzo38computer wrote:

The problem with the Apple iPod is that is DRM. Many people will go into the Apple store and tell people which products are defective by design.

The one on Nintendo DS, if isn't DRM, then it is probably better in some ways.

Hm, this may be a bit of a silly question (and a wee bit off topic), but what exactly is wrong with iPod/iTunes in terms of DRM? I have neither so I know little about them. From what I've been told you can copy MP3s onto an iPod, play them, and copy them back onto any DRM-free player without hassle. What exactly are the restrictions being enforced here?
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HyperHacker wrote:

Hm, this may be a bit of a silly question (and a wee bit off topic), but what exactly is wrong with iPod/iTunes in terms of DRM? I have neither so I know little about them. From what I've been told you can copy MP3s onto an iPod, play them, and copy them back onto any DRM-free player without hassle. What exactly are the restrictions being enforced here?

Unlike most other players, the iPod does not play songs copied into ordinary folders using the standard USB mass storage interface. The iPod plays only those MP3s that are copied into an invisible folder and listed by name in an invisible file of proprietary format.

A lot of the criticism of iPod comes from the vertical tying between iPod players and the iTunes Store. Songs from iTunes Store have limitations on the number of computers on which they can be listened to, and they can't be listened to on anything but an Apple? iPod? player, an Apple? Macintosh? computer, or a computer running a recent Microsoft? Windows? operating system. It's also difficult to make fair-use parody mash-ups of songs from the iTunes Store.
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My wishlist:

*Labels/Catagorys/Tags. Anyone that use's Gmail should know, and love, their label system. It makes perfect sense for music. As the same song could fall into too different catagorys. It would be nice to be able to play, say all the "happy" songs without worrying about folders.
Of course, this is a lot of work.

* The ability to read an ebook in a dsorganiser-ish style interface. Reading + Music = my heaven.
Again, probably not the easiest feature.

To be honest, I dont care for lyrics or pictures much personaly.

tepples wrote:

SyntaxGS wrote:

You guys honestly thing Apple would come after Lick for doing this? Dun think so.

Developers of freeware tetromino games didn't think Mr. Rogers and his Tetris Company would come after them either. Nor did Avery Lee, maintainer of VirtualDub video capture and conversion software, expect a letter from Microsoft demanding removal of support for ASF.

To be fair though:
a) The creator of tetris hardly got bugger all for his work, so when he finaly got the rights, his companys going to try to claw back as much as possible. (even if it seems irrational to us).

b) ASF, the shitty format that it is, microsoft likes to think is secure. The old vdub made it a piece of piss to rip so-called secure files of the net, and then resave them as a new format.
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Cool idea, but it can be used much better.

First off, the circular wheel is silly on a square touch screen. You could better take advantage of a scroll zone, seen on many laptop touch pads.

The bottom screen could also be used for album art and other info while the top perpetually displays folders and such.

Or, a spectrum analyzer, or some other cool thing. Button control shouldn't be left out entirely, but the touch interface is a nice touch.

I know you've got the whole iPod clone thing going on, but I think the concept itself is better played to the DS's strengths and equipment than throwing some cool stuff away to better fit the look and functionality of a iPod.

Also note the scroll wheel doesn't work without the stylus if you use a harder screen protector.
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I like where this project is going. An mp3 player with playlist and streaming capabilites would be topps. :D

Darkflame wrote:

*Labels/Catagorys/Tags. Anyone that use's Gmail should know, and love, their label system. It makes perfect sense for music. As the same song could fall into too different catagorys. It would be nice to be able to play, say all the "happy" songs without worrying about folders.
Of course, this is a lot of work.

I considered doing this, but then I realized you could just make multiple playlists. EG I have one playlist containing all my JPop, one holding my rock, etc; there's some overlap, and of course I have the one "main" list I usually play.
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You know how if you play music on Moonshell while the volume is set to X400? It would be nice if you could remedy the bad sound quality that is produced when the volume is too loud. But I think that's a hardware limitation...
>_<

yes this will definately happen if committment is evident in the project
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FireSlash wrote:

Cool idea, but it can be used much better.

First off, the circular wheel is silly on a square touch screen. You could better take advantage of a scroll zone, seen on many laptop touch pads.

You have a point. I think a square wheel would be better. Also, Apple wouldn't have a leg to stand on then :-)
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A square wheel sounds a bit asinine at first, but thinking about it, a rectangular border that you "scrub" would have the same effect, be original in design, and allow you to follow it without looking because of the edges of the screen.

Indeed, the shape of the scroll pad doesn't really matter since we're using a >stylus; it's precise and accurate! Unless, you're using your finger, then I don't think it'll matter. But a circular scroll pad DOES look the best in terms of looks/design, though. >_>

i have had this idea and i posted on serveral forums and one thing people kept bringing up was
"Except Apple has a patent on the touch-wheel interface, and there's no blanket exemption for non-commercial use in the patent laws."
im posting this to show my support but also to lay that myth to rest

even if they have a patent on the click wheel
they have filed for a patent application but the haven't gotten it on number 20060026535
which is a
"mode-based graphical user interfaces for touch sensitive input devices", which generates and operates virtual GUI control elements depending on where the user touches the screen."
this was a pending patent and i believe it still is

so hopefully this stops the "apple will sue you and kill your family" thing before it fully starts

u should becareful with the trademark :)

Yeah, it won't be called iPod of course.
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a question,
will it be able to play mp4 files or something like that :D
like the real Ipod Video :)
or listen to music while you watching pics :D

i think it should be the whole package:
Images .jpg, .bmp, .png and more
Video .mov, .mp4, .3gp, AVC, OGG
Music .mp3, .mod, Ogg

if this is all possible
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Wait wait wait...

Don't forget that it's on a DS ! ! ! No on a Ipod !
DS only has 4Mo free of RAM, so MOV MP4 will be VERY difficult to play, if the could !

Anyway, good job Lick !

A nice feature, very simple I think, would be a "Click" sound while the pod is turning...a simple "cliquetis", like the sound of "Opera DS Browser" when scawling...

Darkgilson
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biohazard_star wrote:

You know how if you play music on Moonshell while the volume is set to X400? It would be nice if you could remedy the bad sound quality that is produced when the volume is too loud. But I think that's a hardware limitation...
>_<

There's a limit to how loud the sound hardware can be made. When you want to go above that limit, you can increase the volume of the sound data, but unless it is a very quiet sound, there will be distortion. It's the same as increasing the volume in the pre-amp in the EQ in Winamp.

or the same as increase the volume of an amp with a guitar plugged: you get distortion if you go too high ^^

jester wrote:

i think it should be the whole package:
Images .jpg, .bmp, .png and more
Video .mov, .mp4, .3gp, AVC, OGG
Music .mp3, .mod, Ogg

if this is all possible

Ifyou could do that it would be immense but simple steps are what are needed images and music. MPEG 4 compression is a high aim and if you do suceed in implementing it there will be major reprocussions and hopefully showing the DS's true power.

but, on a lighter note, I really like how this project is progressing and hope that it will progress into an mp4 player (fingers crossed).
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But at least it could use soft saturation, not hard clipping. It's like the difference between valve overdrive and transistor overdrive.
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the ipod trademark might be a problem
apple has sent notices to music hardware makers using the pod name because its close to ipod and also with podcast because they are waiting on there trademark of ipodcast and they are afraid of it not being granted because of how common podcast is even though it wont amount to any legal action because that would not be good publicity if they messed with podcasters
but there has been software asked to change its name most if not all have complied with the request
one what to combat this is
if the player became skin-able people could name it what the wish, hope that because its non-comercial homebrew that it goes under the radar, dont officially release it and use one of many anonymous file services on the net, get someone out of apples legal jurisdiction to release it or something similar or simply rename it (maybe something like Ipo DS or just ipo because that implies the ds or something totally original )

dude1 wrote:

the ipod trademark might be a problem
apple has sent notices to music hardware makers using the pod name because its close to ipod and also with podcast because they are waiting on there trademark of ipodcast and they are afraid of it not being granted because of how common podcast is even though it wont amount to any legal action because that would not be good publicity if they messed with podcasters
but there has been software asked to change its name most if not all have complied with the request
one what to combat this is
if the player became skin-able people could name it what the wish, hope that because its non-comercial homebrew that it goes under the radar, dont officially release it and use one of many anonymous file services on the net, get someone out of apples legal jurisdiction to release it or something similar or simply rename it (maybe something like Ipo DS or just ipo because that implies the ds or something totally original )

He said one page ago...

Quote:

Yeah, it won't be called iPod of course.

Read, people. :)
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user6336 wrote:

dude1 wrote:

the ipod trademark might be a problem
apple has sent notices to music hardware makers using the pod name because its close to ipod and also with podcast because they are waiting on there trademark of ipodcast and they are afraid of it not being granted because of how common podcast is even though it wont amount to any legal action because that would not be good publicity if they messed with podcasters
but there has been software asked to change its name most if not all have complied with the request
one what to combat this is
if the player became skin-able people could name it what the wish, hope that because its non-comercial homebrew that it goes under the radar, dont officially release it and use one of many anonymous file services on the net, get someone out of apples legal jurisdiction to release it or something similar or simply rename it (maybe something like Ipo DS or just ipo because that implies the ds or something totally original )

He said one page ago...

Quote:

Yeah, it won't be called iPod of course.

Read, people. :)

yes but this is a semi-detailed reason why people are always curious and want explanation it avoids future clutter in the topic
and yes it wont be ...
but as of right now it is and thats all they need if they were looking for legal trouble
regardless it also has suggestions around that and opinions on a new name if that ends up being the final decision

either your trolling , you dont take you own advice to read or your trying to raise your post count

dude1 wrote:

user6336 wrote:

dude1 wrote:

the ipod trademark might be a problem
apple has sent notices to music hardware makers using the pod name because its close to ipod and also with podcast because they are waiting on there trademark of ipodcast and they are afraid of it not being granted because of how common podcast is even though it wont amount to any legal action because that would not be good publicity if they messed with podcasters
but there has been software asked to change its name most if not all have complied with the request
one what to combat this is
if the player became skin-able people could name it what the wish, hope that because its non-comercial homebrew that it goes under the radar, dont officially release it and use one of many anonymous file services on the net, get someone out of apples legal jurisdiction to release it or something similar or simply rename it (maybe something like Ipo DS or just ipo because that implies the ds or something totally original )

He said one page ago...

Quote:

Yeah, it won't be called iPod of course.

Read, people. :)

yes but this is a semi-detailed reason why people are always curious and want explanation it avoids future clutter in the topic
and yes it wont be ...
but as of right now it is and thats all they need if they were looking for legal trouble
regardless it also has suggestions around that and opinions on a new name if that ends up being the final decision

either your trolling , you dont take you own advice to read or your trying to raise your post count

It was pretty much a general comment that people should read the page before... and if what you say was your original idea, you could just have suggested new names. He's changing the name, and getting worried about something that doesn't even play music, and is created for a niche group (people who own a ds + some kind of flash cart + flashed/superkey type thingy) so I don't think they'd be willing to invest tons of time in trying to shut this down, since it's not really going to affect sales.

And I did read, I don't know what trolling even means, and I could care less about my post count (I've been registered since August 5th and now have just 16 posts)
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Updates:
- menu's are not images anymore. There's a font renderer.
- I added PicodriveDS 0.1.6 fatlib and it's working.
- Batteryicon responds to the charger-plug. (Plug in and see!)
- Hold play-resume and it will reset to the bootmenu. (libcartreset)
- Pre-mature directory listing: go to Music->Songs
- (edit, forgot) When the DS is closed, screens turn off and LED blinks.

Click

I'm still working on it, in case some people wondered.
- Lick
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Last edited by Lick on Thu Nov 30, 2006 10:06 am; edited 1 time in total

I have a possible title change:
iPoDS

BTW, i'm having trouble downloading from you site. It gives me an error and I would like to update my DSLiveWeather and get lovelite.

Lick wrote:

Updates:
- menu's are not images anymore. There's a font renderer.
- I added PicodriveDS 0.1.6 fatlib and it's working.
- Batteryicon responds to the charger-plug. (Plug in and see!)
- Hold play-resume and it will reset to the bootmenu. (libcartreset)
- Pre-mature directory listing: go to Music->Songs

Click

I'm still working on it, in case some people wondered.
- Lick

Looking better every time!

Gunnex wrote:

I have a possible title change:
iPoDS

BTW, i'm having trouble downloading from you site. It gives me an error and I would like to update my DSLiveWeather and get lovelite.

...or even just PoDS :) We need a name that's short, but kinda refers to it's wheel and it's on the ds, or it's an ipod ripoff :)
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The battery icon doesn't work on my FlashMe v7 DS. It shows the charging symbol all the time. This program is cool, but I think using the buttons would be easier than using the touchscreen.

Lick, looking good!

A few comments: Like someone said already, you might want to try how 90 degrees rotated controls play... Holding DS just like with Brain Age (perhaps even having options if you're right or left handed), touch screen for the interface and main data, other screen for the playlists and secondary data.

Also, when implementing the actual player, not just the interface, using Moonshell as a backbone would seem like a solid option. Why reinvent the wheel when there's already a player that does most of the wanted features?

Looking forward how this will turn out. Would use this definitely myself. And perhaps even convince a couple of iPod-loving friends into getting a DS Lite ;)

iPoDS is too much like iPod. I rather have a whole new and different cool name like .bleepz, hehe.
lick.huuf.net is off line for an unknown amount of time. Huuf was hacked or something.

This project is merely trying to recreate an iPod. Don't want to change the interface much.
Moonshells source code is the worst ever. I can't make nothing of it. Don't worry, I'll have sound in the next release.
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I really like the interface and stuff. It's really well-done. It'll probably replace MoonShell as my music player, if it works well in the end.

Good luck.

Hi Lick,

Looking really good, Using DS-X with flashme v7, I get a green battery in the top left corner, and a green battery in the top right hand corner of the menu box.

But I also get a 1/2 battery indictaor in the top left hand corner.... just to the right of the first one.

There are 3 little dots above the battery at the top left hand corner (Assuming charge indicator)

Looks great though....

I like Bleepz as a name as well

muggsy

Some very good work here :)
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call it Double Sound!
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iPlayerDS?
iPortableDS?
iJukeboxDS?

:D

Can't wait for the next release.. :O Looking sweet so far.

Is there any chance we'd be getting the source or the object file to use the scrollscreen interface in our programs?
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Mr Snowflake wrote:

Is there any chance we'd be getting the source or the object file to use the scrollscreen interface in our programs?

Here you go: http://www.uploadline.com/line/6129499/clickwheel.zip.html

;)
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i've seen nothing but good programs from you so im sure this can be great, even with a name like bleepz ;) j/k

With a name like bleepz, does it automatically recognize sensitive words such as shit or democracy and bleep them out? :-)
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Lick wrote:

Updates:
- Batteryicon responds to the charger-plug. (Plug in and see!)

not for me using a old ds and sc sd :(

johnnyoc3 wrote:

Lick wrote:

Updates:
- Batteryicon responds to the charger-plug. (Plug in and see!)

not for me using a old ds and sc sd :(

same here!

Also, using a suggestion from someone above, just make the name dSound, or something that uses the iPod style name, but not using those terms (neither i nor pod)... also, it'd be cool if you could put the time in there too (12hr clock) :)
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I thought "DSound" was both DirectSound (the Microsoft Windows DirectX audio API) and Direct Sound (the Game Boy Advance PCM stream channel).
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-- I think he moved to Tilwick.

tepples wrote:

I thought "DSound" was both DirectSound (the Microsoft Windows DirectX audio API) and Direct Sound (the Game Boy Advance PCM stream channel).

How about dPlay? I know it doesn't have an 'S', but the version names (ex: "Vesper" for DSLiveWeather) can begin with 'S'. :)
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DSLivePlayer? DSLiveMedia? DSLiveMediaPlayer?
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Isn't Live copyrighted by Microsoft ? :P

Lick wrote:

DSLivePlayer? DSLiveMedia? DSLiveMediaPlayer?

DSLivePlayer sounds good, DSLiveMedia just doesn't flow that well, and DSLiveMediaPlayer just sounds too long! :)
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DualSounDS
DuoSounDS
DreamSounDS ... ? :)

iDS
Portable Stereo Sound
...hmm..

Lick's Dual iSound? Or for short: LickDiS? ;)

i think DSound is the best option. or maybe dPod?

Erm, the name isn't important. The program is. Forget this naming babble and just let Lick get on with coding cool stuff, as he does :-)
_________________
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You can find my NDS homebrew projects here...

Lick, looks good. I will play with it more tonight.

For my naming 2 cents ~ N-Pod or Nin-Pod

DSLivePlayer is a very good name.

Continue the good works with these excelent apps. Looking forward tu mp3 support !

RockPOD :D
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hey maybe somebody can build games in it like the real i pod

DSound-Good
DualSound-Very Good
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I made a hell lot of small changes and I added sound. Currently the Songs menu and the Now Playing screen are working (Ogg comments and ID3v1 tag implemented). Still no sound playback.

Grab the latest here.
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Last edited by Lick on Sun Dec 03, 2006 12:11 am; edited 1 time in total

Out of interest, what library do you use to decode the MP3s? libmad?
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the link your gave out is death...

SounDS, or if you prefer, sOunDS. :p Also, a battery icon just showing the high/low/charging state is kinda pointless since there are LEDs dedicated to that already. Now, find a way to accurately measure remaining life and we'll be getting somewhere. ;)
_________________
I'm a PSP hacker now, but I still <3 DS.

Hmmmmmm....

You could write a little app the times draining the battery under various CPU loads and then use that to come up with some kinda funky calculation based on current CPU usage, or something :-)
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You can find my NDS homebrew projects here...

the link is dead... please upload it again... thx ^^

d4rkb1t

Here is the working link

http://www.uploadline.com/line/317577/1_pods.zip.html

DSound would be the best name!
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Ok, all this name stuff is getting annoying, I dont think sound should be in the name, sounds so predictable... Now you got me talking about it >_< But seriously, i think the thread should be left for updates and feedback.

Jabba wrote:

Ok, all this name stuff is getting annoying, I dont think sound should be in the name, sounds so predictable... Now you got me talking about it >_< But seriously, i think the thread should be left for updates and feedback.

I agree, I keep getting e-mail notifications every time a new post is added, and I come back hoping to read progress updates or try out a new build, only to find some more name suggestions. Name is secondary.

I think it would be nice if this project is to use the 32MB RAM of the Supercard series to play more "regular" formats, not just dpg. Also, I think you should just leave the name as DS iPOD. It sounds nice, and I doubt Apple will sue you.

not everyone has a Supercard series cart
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jester wrote:

not everyone has a Supercard series cart

True. Single-media compatibillity would simply be... dumb.

well as long as the App is progressing bit by bit!
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HyperHacker wrote:

Now, find a way to accurately measure remaining life and we'll be getting somewhere. ;)

Hmmm... Not possible. The battery icons are there to make the application more iPoddish, which is my main goal. =)

I found a small bug in the code that caused the music library only to load 4 files max and the rest fails. =/

I haven't decoded MP3 yet. I'm going to start with OGG.
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Lick wrote:

HyperHacker wrote:

Now, find a way to accurately measure remaining life and we'll be getting somewhere. ;)

Hmmm... Not possible. The battery icons are there to make the application more iPoddish, which is my main goal. =)

At least have three icons (normal, low and charging). :)
_________________
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I have 3 battery icons. (Charging icon only works on Lite)
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Lick wrote:

I found a small bug in the code that caused the music library only to load 4 files max and the rest fails. =/ .

Do you have a plan to get past this?
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Oh, yeah I already fixed it haha. I wanted to upload it so I removed that other link, but I didn't have time to update the post. Sorry for the confusion.
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NeX wrote:

jester wrote:

not everyone has a Supercard series cart

True. Single-media compatibillity would simply be... dumb.

No reason it couldn't use M3 and G6's RAM too, and still run on GBAMP without the functionality that requires it.
_________________
I'm a PSP hacker now, but I still <3 DS.

The problem with use of adapter RAM becoming more accepted is that the temptation is there to make all functionality require it.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.

Well, maybe he can make 2 versions, with one supporting more formats using the added RAM, and another one simply using dpg or something. There's really no need for us to have the crab mentality just because not everyone has a flashcart with the added RAM. /no offense intended

hi lick, i just wanna ask if u will enable the usage of the directional keys as well as abxylr incase some ppl get tired of using the touchscreen. u noe, sometimes its just kinda hard to take out the stylus and swirl or turn or twist or watever u call it. its just a matter of convenience.

btw, i tried out ur latest build. thumbs up for it. it looks really good indeed. more than i expected.

one more thing, i noticed there was a video section. would this section use dpg or a new form of nds video or would it use some pre existing format such as mp4 or anything thats takes up less resouces.

Could always use your tongue to twirl the twirler :-)

As for video stuff, it would be nice if someone in the homebrew community could put together a nice OSS video codec for the DS (Since it can be done, no question...)
_________________
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You can find my NDS homebrew projects here...

It would be nice.

But come on...Text+Audio has to be easier then video, yet nothing other then Linux, or the GBAMP'd built in firmware does it yet.
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OOPMan wrote:

Could always use your tongue to twirl the twirler :-)

As for video stuff, it would be nice if someone in the homebrew community could put together a nice OSS video codec for the DS (Since it can be done, no question...)

I'd love that, but it'd take quite a bit of effort, and good coding skills to do it. :(
At the very least, someone could optimize Moonshell (dithering, please!) and we'd get much better results.

link what font will u use?`
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Err.. Lick? I'm using Myriad.
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Uhm... Lick ? Can your Software (was it called bezzp ? ) already play Music Files ? If, how can it ? I tried to load an .mp3 file, didn't worked... .ogg didn't worked too... And: Why does it shwo this "searching for music libary" or something like this dialog at the startup of the Player ?

One more thing: If I go to Music > Songs I get many File not listet and only the one .mp3 I have in the Root... (I use Gbamp) the previous version worked fine...

Hope you answer:

Pas

"Refreshing Music Library": the software is looking for MP3/OGG files and is building lists. (Playlists, artists, albums, songs..)

The software doesn't playback any sound, YET. (Working on OGG playback at the moment.)

- Lick
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OK, thanks for clearing that up... One more "offtopic" Question:
I saw that you started an App called: DSLiveHotspot... When will you continue it ? (Will you even continue it ? )

DSLiveHotSpots: probably won't continue it.
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http://www.filecrunch.com/file/~56gext

It plays OGGs, VERY CHOPPY! Music->Songs->(your ogg file)->Play.

It's choppy because I haven't implemented sound timing yet. Screen turns off after 5 seconds (or when lid is closed).
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testing now....

using scsd i just get a refreshing music library message that dont go away

Devil_Spawn wrote:

testing now....

using scsd i just get a refreshing music library message that dont go away

I got that too, but it eventually does go away... after a LONG time! :) Can't wait for nice .ogg playback! :)
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Lick wrote:

http://www.filecrunch.com/file/~56gext

It plays OGGs, VERY CHOPPY! Music->Songs->(your ogg file)->Play.

It's choppy because I haven't implemented sound timing yet. Screen turns off after 5 seconds (or when lid is closed).

Are you using Tremor in low accuracy or high accuracy mode? The option for either one would be nice. High accuracy requires more CPU, so the maximum quality level that it can play is lower (depending on how well you optimize it, Moonshell can do ~128kbps), but it does sound nicer.

I only get the refreshing music library message for a short time on my SCSD. Does it depend on how many files are on your card?

It hangs at the "Songs" screen if the ID3 tag contains non ascii characters.

when i scroll down (more than 4 lines) in the SOngs Menu, the ipod will crash

Mhh thanks Lick for this !

But my songs are very very SLOW ! The sounds is very bad (don't take it bad... ! ;) )

The same OGG files are almost perfect with Moonshell... But I believe that it uses another decoder...(plugin).

Anyway, that's a great application.
Two things I believe easy to do :
- A clock ! ! (on the upper screen, near the battery icon ?)
- Perhaps possibility to choose the menus with the Buttons of the DS ( + AB XY etc... )

Thanks, and good luck for the sequel !

Darkgilson
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Moonshell, by default, uses Tremor in low accuracy mode. In the distribution, there's a high accuracy version of ogg.msp, but that's limited to about 128kbps (I use it since I encode my vorbis to -q2 anyway, and it sounds better)

Given that the DS's DAC is limited to 10 bits and 32.7 kHz, does the high accuracy version add anything?
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.

Yes. There's some strange artifacts with Tremor in low accuracy mode that you can hear sometimes that aren't there in the high accuracy mode.

Okay it seems that ogg is decoding now at (faster than) real-time speed, high accuracy mode. Awesome. (For all you people trying to decode with Tremor, add -D_ARM_ASSEM_ to your CFLAGS in the Makefile. It speeds up the decoding by a lot. Also, remove the ARCH option, which contains -mthumb. Don't know if you need -mthumb-interwork though.)

But I still can't seem to remove all of the clicking and noise.. Anyone know what's up with that? I think it has to do with the ARM9 commanding the ARM7 to switch buffers, but there is a delay? I tried disabling the Vblank interrupt, but still I could hear an unusual jam. Like 'laaaaaaaa' becomes 'laa aaa aaa'.
I hope someone knows.

I'm going to add MP3 decoding now. When that's done, I'll add playlists, artists and albums.

Grab the files here: http://www.filecrunch.com/file/~kptof4
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very quiet!

I get the clicky/jumpyness too

It's getting there!

left my ds on for 10 mins, refreshing music library still on-screen, scsd

great work!

have you thought about adding support for winamp skins ?

Lick: Moonshell implements 4x oversampling on playback to improve how it sounds. You might need to do the same, though I don't know if it's related to your clicking issue.

Firon wrote:

Lick: Moonshell implements 4x oversampling on playback to improve how it sounds. You might need to do the same, though I don't know if it's related to your clicking issue.

Is that with EVERY file? I saw the same thing and I thought it was for slower files. Not sure. But thanks for the suggestion, I'll look into it when I'mdone with MP3! ;)

009: Winamp skins? They don't fit the GUI elements though. But I could release the sound code in an easy form so people could write their own music players. Heheh..

- Lick
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Lick wrote:

'laaaaaaaa' becomes 'laa aaa aaa'.
I hope someone knows.

Yeah, same thing with my Supercard SD.
But I think that MP3will be easier to do (no ?).
Anyway, it's a great job, as usual ! ;)

You were planning to add skins support. Off course, winamp skins are impossible, but like moonshell, BMP files on a specific folder should be fine.
I really do want a black version of DS iPod ! =D

Good luck and thanks again !

Darkgilson
_________________
Soon Blubb in 3D !

Awesome, Lick.... keep goin! This will slowly overtake Moonshell as the premiere mp3 player for the DS. ;)
_________________
Nintendo DS Onyx :: Supercard Lite :: Superkey :: 1GB microSD

Great Lick! I believe this program will rock in little time! As soon as you add mp3 support ;)
KEep up!

----> BUG report <----

I found a small bug in ds iPod.
When I play a song, and I want to "pause" it, I press the Pause Key ( II ).
The song is stopped, but I can't resume to the moment I was listening to by pressing the same key... I don't know if you can understand me, I'm not an english man! ; )
Oh, and the title of the song doesn't move on the top screen when I play the song. When stopped, it does.
And what is the Hold function? (with SELECT )... An icon appears...
Cheers,
Darkgilson
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Soon Blubb in 3D !

Hi darkgilson.

Quote:

Oh, and the title of the song doesn't move on the top screen when I play the song. When stopped, it does.

I think this is right, and not a bug.

Quote:

And what is the Hold function? (with SELECT )... An icon appears...

Select acts as Lock button, so a "Lock" appears in the screen, meaning that all the buttons are disabled

Hmm... sad that you probably won,t update DSLivehotspot... I thought if you could complete it you could give outbthe source so people can use it in their Wifiapps... Anyway: Good work with Blepzz (is this name right ? ) Hope you add mp3 soon ;). Oh and: if you have finished all: Song playback text and image viewing and so on, could you then please add those minigames implemented in Real Ipods in your program too ? (I know it would be useless ;) but I love such kind of things )

Greets:

Pas

Lick wrote:

Okay it seems that ogg is decoding now at (faster than) real-time speed, high accuracy mode. Awesome. (For all you people trying to decode with Tremor, add -D_ARM_ASSEM_ to your CFLAGS in the Makefile. It speeds up the decoding by a lot. Also, remove the ARCH option, which contains -mthumb. Don't know if you need -mthumb-interwork though.)

Moonshell has it compiled with -mthumb-interwork in ARCH, so maybe it is. :)
There might be a performance difference, so try comparing with and without.

Are you going to use libmad for mp3 decoding?

Found a small bug: Ogg Vorbis files with one channel only (mono) play twice as fast as normal stereo files.

melw: true, I haven't really programmed a mono playback mode. Hehe.

Firon: thanks for the info. I'm using libmad yes. Tremor (ogg) is much friendlier though.

pas: first things first! ;)

darkgilson: it's supposed to stop scrolling when playing, so it saves CPU power. Also, the playback is very experimental, it was a preview version anyway. Expect better things in the future!

Currently I've got MP3 playback as well, but I need a way to buffer the over-decoded parts. Will release preview again soon.
- Lick
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Nice work lick this is looking to be one of the best Homebrew apps for the DS atm, and is slowy taking over moonshell ;) its looking very nice, keep it up!

cant wait for the final version

Though im very excited about this, saying its slowly over taking Moonshell is just silly, its still in beta and cant do anything better than moonshell yet, and moonshell has a lot of features, lets wait untill the first versions out before saying things like that.

isnt it nice when people dont detect sarcasm, sometimes i end sarcasm with a wink but thats just me ;)

http://www.filecrunch.com/file/~bu6o1o

MP3 and OGG playback are both working, but gaps/clicks/noises are still there. Don't worry, I'm going to fix all of that even if it takes meh loif!!

BTW: I hope you guys know by now that holding the Pause/Resume button will reset to slot-2 bootmenu.. 'Cuz you figured that out already, right? =)

- Lick
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Thanks, I'll check it tonight... As usual, I'm sure it's a good job =D
_________________
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is this for supercard?!

It should work on the Supercard. It works on my SC miniSD.
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works on supercard CF

does it work with G6? because moonshell doesn't see the mp3 file on my card...

Been trying this for the first time today and, wow, am I impressed :) . The GUI looks very nice, great work.

For the bug report:
The Program crashed when it tried to display a MP3 with an umlaut in the song title ID3 tag. It crashed on several other occasions, too, but that was rather random and I unfortunately couldn't replicate these yet :( . It *could* be possible that german songs were involved there, too, but I'm not sure about it.

Thanks for sharing, I like that programm very much :) .

Last edited by NorQue on Wed Dec 13, 2006 10:24 pm; edited 1 time in total

Very good improvements!! Keep up with these great project

Tried a couple of mp3s with this. They all worked except one, which played at the wrong speed (half the speed?). On my PC, Foobar plays it OK.

(snipped from Foobar)

bitrate = 128
codec = MP3
channels = 2
samplerate = 44100
mp3_stereo_mode = joint stereo
----------
7511663 samples @ 44100Hz

I'm running off an M3SD. I can send you mp3 file if you want. That aside, it's all shaping up nicely.

Welcome to licensing hell:

Be Vorbis only it is cheaper.

If you are linking against libmad then you have to release your source code under the GNU General Public License V2.0.

And that is before Apple come saying hello.

Very nice piece of software. I particularly like the sound when scrolling between menu options. It should not make a difference but it does.

I might choose NOT to distribute it AT ALL. I'll keep it on my computer and on my DS and share it with no one. =)
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and lick didnt mean that did, did he?
T_T *cries*

btw, i tried it out. neat. but i thought when playing songs, if u swirl in circles the volume is supposed to increase? or that hasnt been implemented yet?

No. Please don't! You'll be killing the greatest homebrew app ever made if you do that. T_T

Bug:
- both the screen and the backlight turns off when the DS goes into standby mode. I'm using a SC SD and a DS Lite.

Anyone know where I can find an app so I can add the info thingy the iPOD displays when you play a song? You know, the info with the album pic, artist, etc.

Erm iTunes... You know, the software used in conjuction with the iPod :p lol

http://www.apple.com/itunes/

Have a blast!

*feels embarassed*

Sorry, I didn't know iTunes had that feature. I don't really have an iPOD... Well, I was supposed to have one, but umm... let's just say it went to someone else as a nice little present. :)

Lick wrote:

It should work on the Supercard. It works on my SC miniSD.

on my SClite it will crash, no chance to play some files..

nice , i'm working @ apple as technical support , if you have any question , feel free to ask :)
greetz

http://www.gigasize.com/get.php/234684/LMP.zip

Added progress bar. Fixed some bugs.
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I wanted to give feedback about the previous version, but you already did an update xD ;-)
I don't have an iPod, but is the weel used to travel in the song ? (FF, RW etc...)
Bedankt voor alles Lick !
Darkgilson

[EDIT] heuum...gigaset says that the file is protected with a password! what do we need to do?
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Last edited by darkgilson on Thu Dec 14, 2006 9:44 pm; edited 1 time in total

There are some "problems":
If i listen to a song with album tags, and then switch to one with no tags, it's displayed the album of the previous song.
Then, if I close the lid, the music stops (on speakers, on the headphones it's ok)

darkgilson wrote:

heuum...gigaset says that the file is protected with a password! what do we need to do?

The password is next to the text-input (right there on the GigaSize download page)! Simply enter those characters and press the button.
Those FF/RW functions aren't implemented yet.. ;)

falcon!!! wrote:

There are some "problems":
If i listen to a song with album tags, and then switch to one with no tags, it's displayed the album of the previous song.
Then, if I close the lid, the music stops (on speakers, on the headphones it's ok)

Thanks for reporting that! I will fix it asap.
I will add an option to close the lid but still keeping the sound. The way it currently works is actually better for the batterylife. (DSOrganize does the same, and so do professional games. Only Moonshell doesn't do it..)

- Lick
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Great! thanks for the quick reply and also for the new version ^^
Anyway, it's already possible to display the image of the albums or you didnt implement it yet?

Still thinking about optimized way (in terms of speed AND size) to cache playlists, albums (and covers) and other listings.
Any suggestions?
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u dont seriously intend to add all these features??!?!
like the new name sounds cool 2 me
also, i noticed that if you sleep the ds, whilst the backlight has allready turned off then open it again, it does not resume play through the speakers, and the screens stay off untill you tap something

an adjustable backlight timeout would be cool

Lick wrote:

Still thinking about optimized way (in terms of speed AND size) to cache playlists, albums (and covers) and other listings.
Any suggestions?

Have it save the searching for media library file as a file on the card (like in dsliveweather, which i think you are familiar with :P) then just press start or select (can't remember which isn't used), and it'll rescan the library. So when you turn it on it won't have to scan it all over again :)
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I think your best bet is make a database of all the relevant data.
It'd be up to you whether you put the scanner on the PC and then transfer the DB to the SD card (like iTunes), or do it on the DS. If you did it on the DS, it'd probably be very slow.
Perhaps a combination of the two could work. You could let the user choose to rescan on the DS if they wanted to for some reason.

somethings wrong with the GigaSize link. The Zip is empty and ive tried it on two computers!

*edit* Nevermind, something screwy with I.E.

Worked with firefox

using SCLite, it won't pick up any of my files. Keep getting a 404 error?

daitienshi wrote:

using SCLite, it won't pick up any of my files. Keep getting a 404 error?

go to music -> songs..

but on my SCLite, it will crash

KaKiT wrote:

daitienshi wrote:

using SCLite, it won't pick up any of my files. Keep getting a 404 error?

go to music -> songs..

but on my SCLite, it will crash

that's what I mean, every menu where it should show album or song titles keeps coming back with 404. Even when trying to go to the settings

Hmmmm, while the touch interface is nice, I would like it if there was keypad support, even if it is not quite in the spirit of things...
_________________
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You can find my NDS homebrew projects here...

OOPMan wrote:

Hmmmm, while the touch interface is nice, I would like it if there was keypad support, even if it is not quite in the spirit of things...

I'll go along with that - having touchscreen support is excellent, but equivalent keypad support would also be a very sensible, logical and welcome addition. :)

Just a quick question or two...

Is there a specific folder structure I should use to store my files in the memory card? can I place them anywhere I want? can I have subfolders? how do you get the category, genre, album, artist information? is that stored inside each MP3 itself? or is there a separate file such as the iTunes.XML file?

Would it be possible to make it so that we can use iTunes to import our CDs and then just copy the entire iTunes folder into the memory card and have it work just like it would on an iPod? That would truly be awesome. I am not asking to be able to sync with iTunes, just to be able to go into windows explorer and use "Send To" to send the entire iTunes folder to the memory card. That would rock.

Anyway, I tried it with a few mp3s in the root directory and they worked great, can't wait to see your future updates to this awesome program.

You can put files anywhere on the card. Why don't you try it?:)

ID3/Vorbis comment for song info.
_________________
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I can't download the file..

I always get an empty zip file, and it doesn't work with any other web browser...

I'll wait for an update of LMP or another link...

Cheers,
_________________
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Is your implementation of ID3 v1 or v2?

darkgilson wrote:

I can't download the file..

I always get an empty zip file, and it doesn't work with any other web browser...

I'll wait for an update of LMP or another link...

Cheers,

Here you are
http://rapidshare.com/files/7737788/LMP.nds.html

i get on my M3 CF and may GBAMP both the same error: 404 error
where do i have to put the music? are subfolders allready supported?

You get 404 error if you look in the erroneous folders.
You have got to look under musics > songs and here you'll find all your mp3/ogg in your CF

falcon!!! wrote:

You get 404 error if you look in the erroneous folders.
You have got to look under musics > songs and here you'll find all your mp3/ogg in your CF

i dont know why, if i go there, the screens go messed up and the app crashes, maybe i have to much mp3s on my cf card yet???

P.S. it seems the app has problems with mp3 in VBR quality...
and another one: if a song ends, it doesnt play the next...

Thank you for your reports Ohr
So you have problems with VBR mp3? Have you tried replacing them with other bitrate mp3? Is it working fine?

wtf! i converted(used GoldWave) a song 3 times with different settings:
1. 44100 Hz, 192kbps, stereo
2. 44100 Hz, 128kbps, stereo
3. 44100 Hz, 32000-320000bits VBR V0, stereo

and all of them are messed up!!! (with Moonshell, they are all played fine...).

here are the different settings of the song(a small part of Akeboshi - The Audience): http://rapidshare.com/files/7842554/LMP_test.rar.html

?hr wrote:

wtf! i converted(used GoldWave) a song 3 times with different settings:
1. 44100 Hz, 192kbps, stereo
2. 44100 Hz, 128kbps, stereo
3. 44100 Hz, 32000-320000bits VBR V0, stereo

and all of them are messed up!!! (with Moonshell, they are all played fine...).

here are the different settings of the song(a small part of Akeboshi - The Audience): http://rapidshare.com/files/7842554/LMP_test.rar.html

He stated earlier in this thread that no music plays properly yet, because he just added playback. So none of your settings are going to work with this program yet.
_________________
http://prdesign.co.nr
All shirts just $11.11 each!

They all play fine with my gbamp!
I mean, they play just like all the other songs i have

Songs play good for me too (exept the stuttering), I never thought that my DS is capable of list files like you like (e.g. mp3, .ogg ...)

oh sorry, i meant the stuttering... forget what i said

anyway, back to the other bug: my ds crashes(screens are also getting messed up) if i choose musics -> songs, but i think its just because i have to much songs on my cf card: 754 mp3s(also scanning takes a bit long :) )

will this eventually have video and photos? and if so will the video have a cool new format like .lmf (lick media file) or something like .dpg that would be COOL
_________________
If anyone needs a dragonball online email me @ aaronthejester@hotmail.com

Erm, guys, Lick will announce a full feature set when he's ready, I'm guessing...

I think his priorities are likely to be, in order:

Music
Photos
Video

I'm guessing video is low priority due to the general state of video on the DS...
_________________
"My boot, your face..." - Attributed to OOPMan, Emperor of Eroticon VI

You can find my NDS homebrew projects here...

thanks for the note OOPMan
_________________
If anyone needs a dragonball online email me @ aaronthejester@hotmail.com

Sorry for the absence lately, I'm kinda busy with school and christmas. I'm posting this url for future reference' sake. Don't expect that all those will be included.
_________________
http://licklick.wordpress.com

Aaah RockBox, I used this on my iPod (when i had one) its a very good program, if you can get something like this on the DS it would be very good indeed.

Well, i think mp3, wav, wma, midi and some tracker would be enough

and OGG, of course?
_________________
http://aaiiee.wordpress.com/

WMA? Isn't that some odd format that works only on PlaysForS*** and Zune devices?
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.

A few non-Microsoft MP3 players claim to play WMA, but I haven't seen one actually do it. I think WMA/WMV is just a container format (ugh) that supports DRM (double ugh) and can only be played on Windows by having the WMP code do the actual decoding (triple ugh).
_________________
I'm a PSP hacker now, but I still <3 DS.

My cheap no brand S1mp3 player plays WMA.
_________________
Nintendo DS homebrew on Wikipedia

gbadev.org forum archive

DS homebrew announcements > Licks Media Player (LMP) - DISCONTINUED!!

#110216 - Lick - Sun Nov 26, 2006 10:32 pm

#110217 - darkgilson - Sun Nov 26, 2006 10:37 pm

#110222 - Dan2552 - Sun Nov 26, 2006 11:11 pm

#110224 - user6336 - Sun Nov 26, 2006 11:17 pm

#110236 - felix123 - Mon Nov 27, 2006 5:00 am

#110238 - SyntaxGS - Mon Nov 27, 2006 5:27 am

#110239 - tepples - Mon Nov 27, 2006 5:36 am

#110269 - biohazard_star - Mon Nov 27, 2006 10:18 am

#110277 - Lick - Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:52 pm

#110284 - muggsy - Mon Nov 27, 2006 3:25 pm

#110291 - zzo38computer - Mon Nov 27, 2006 6:13 pm

#110293 - jester - Mon Nov 27, 2006 6:20 pm

#110294 - OOPMan - Mon Nov 27, 2006 6:22 pm

#110296 - jester - Mon Nov 27, 2006 6:23 pm

#110299 - Lick - Mon Nov 27, 2006 6:54 pm

#110304 - jester - Mon Nov 27, 2006 7:18 pm

#110307 - Lick - Mon Nov 27, 2006 7:51 pm

#110308 - awh85 - Mon Nov 27, 2006 7:58 pm

#110312 - jojotjuh - Mon Nov 27, 2006 8:58 pm

#110318 - jester - Mon Nov 27, 2006 9:33 pm

#110321 - OOPMan - Mon Nov 27, 2006 9:36 pm

#110326 - TheYak - Mon Nov 27, 2006 10:00 pm

#110329 - Lick - Mon Nov 27, 2006 10:24 pm

#110331 - roylazarovich - Mon Nov 27, 2006 10:45 pm

#110333 - user6336 - Mon Nov 27, 2006 10:54 pm

#110354 - mastertop101 - Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:06 am

#110357 - HyperHacker - Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:31 am

#110378 - tepples - Tue Nov 28, 2006 3:33 am

#110383 - Darkflame - Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:00 am

#110387 - FireSlash - Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:30 am

#110399 - SyntaxGS - Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:26 am

#110404 - HyperHacker - Tue Nov 28, 2006 9:08 am

#110407 - biohazard_star - Tue Nov 28, 2006 10:42 am

#110409 - jester - Tue Nov 28, 2006 11:15 am

#110414 - OOPMan - Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:13 pm

#110415 - TheYak - Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:48 pm

#110418 - biohazard_star - Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:31 pm

#110423 - dude1 - Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:22 pm

#110425 - KaKiT - Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:41 pm

#110432 - Lick - Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:48 pm

#110440 - KaKiT - Tue Nov 28, 2006 5:48 pm

#110445 - jester - Tue Nov 28, 2006 5:57 pm

#110447 - darkgilson - Tue Nov 28, 2006 6:04 pm

#110451 - josath - Tue Nov 28, 2006 6:24 pm

#110452 - falcon!!! - Tue Nov 28, 2006 6:31 pm

#110467 - A2hok - Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:31 pm

#110476 - tepples - Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:48 pm

#110520 - dude1 - Wed Nov 29, 2006 12:37 am

#110528 - user6336 - Wed Nov 29, 2006 12:58 am

#110549 - dude1 - Wed Nov 29, 2006 3:56 am

#110630 - user6336 - Thu Nov 30, 2006 12:21 am

#110634 - Lick - Thu Nov 30, 2006 12:27 am

#110647 - Gunnex - Thu Nov 30, 2006 1:28 am

#110649 - user6336 - Thu Nov 30, 2006 1:49 am

#110664 - felix123 - Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:19 am

#110671 - melw - Thu Nov 30, 2006 9:32 am

#110676 - Lick - Thu Nov 30, 2006 10:02 am

#110680 - mntorankusu - Thu Nov 30, 2006 11:24 am

#110689 - muggsy - Thu Nov 30, 2006 3:03 pm

#110690 - Darkflame - Thu Nov 30, 2006 3:07 pm

#110696 - jester - Thu Nov 30, 2006 5:09 pm

#110706 - SyntaxGS - Thu Nov 30, 2006 8:46 pm

#110708 - Mr Snowflake - Thu Nov 30, 2006 9:25 pm

#110711 - Lick - Thu Nov 30, 2006 10:06 pm

#110715 - johnnyoc3 - Thu Nov 30, 2006 10:49 pm

#110717 - tepples - Thu Nov 30, 2006 10:59 pm

#110718 - johnnyoc3 - Thu Nov 30, 2006 11:04 pm

#110719 - user6336 - Thu Nov 30, 2006 11:09 pm

#110722 - tepples - Thu Nov 30, 2006 11:21 pm

#110723 - user6336 - Thu Nov 30, 2006 11:34 pm

#110726 - Lick - Fri Dec 01, 2006 12:17 am

#110727 - mastertop101 - Fri Dec 01, 2006 12:23 am

#110728 - user6336 - Fri Dec 01, 2006 12:26 am

#110740 - parad0x - Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:40 am

#110745 - gm112 - Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:23 am

#110746 - TheYak - Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:35 am

#110749 - johnnyoc3 - Fri Dec 01, 2006 6:18 am

#110759 - OOPMan - Fri Dec 01, 2006 8:41 am