#1234 - jstrout - Wed Jan 15, 2003 9:21 pm
(This somewhat overlaps the last thread, but it's different -- so please bear with me.)
Suppose I've developed the next Metroid and I think my game will sell like hotcakes. Further suppose, for the sake of argument, that I want to publish it myself rather than go through one of the existing publishers.
The big hurdle is: how can I make the cartridges? What companies make these? Any pointers?
In the desktop market, CD duplication services are easy to find. But where are the GBA cart production services?
#1241 - ampz - Wed Jan 15, 2003 10:24 pm
#1245 - jstrout - Wed Jan 15, 2003 10:30 pm
Thanks, you rock! That is exactly what I was looking for.
#1247 - ampz - Wed Jan 15, 2003 10:32 pm
They cannot offer you carts immediately, cuz the cart design is not entirely done yet ;)
You have to be a little patient.
#2634 - barnabe9999 - Sun Feb 09, 2003 6:29 pm
What if I intend to produce carts by myself? Not with a intermediate company...contact directly some factory in China and ask to produce some carts (about 5000)?
There aren't any factory able to produce it in China, TW or HK?
Would that be illegal (produce Nintendo non-autorized carts)?
What about other hardware like MBV2 and other?
Would that be illegal also?
What is the arguments to Nintendo process SongBoy and others companies?
And beyond that, why would nintendo allow Songboy to produce carts to GBA?
#2636 - tepples - Sun Feb 09, 2003 8:19 pm
| barnabe9999 wrote: |
| Would that be illegal (produce Nintendo non-autorized carts)? |
So long as you own the copyright on the ROM data, there's no law keeping you from producing a cartridge without the help of Nintendo. Even including the logo data is lawful, at least for Game Paks sold in the United States, under the Sega v. Accolade precedent.
| Quote: |
| What about other hardware like MBV2 and other? Would that be illegal also? |
Given that Nintendo turned a blind eye to the MBV2 cable when making Lik Sang take Visoly flash products out of its catalog, I'd guess not.
| Quote: |
| What is the arguments to Nintendo process SongBoy and others companies? |
Nintendo made the maker of SongBoy change the name to SongPro because of possible trademark confusion. I don't know whether or not the current SongPro hardware is licensed by Nintendo, but at first, Nintendo refused to license the SongPro hardware or any other custom hardware that connected to the Game Pak connector.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#2637 - ampz - Sun Feb 09, 2003 9:20 pm
| tepples wrote: |
So long as you own the copyright on the ROM data, there's no law keeping you from producing a cartridge without the help of Nintendo. Even including the logo data is lawful, at least for Game Paks sold in the United States, under the Sega v. Accolade precedent.
|
No, the Sega vs Accolade precedent did not involve the SEGA logotype beeing stored in the game itself.
Also, Nintendo has got hundreds of strange patents in the US, at least a few of them probably cover GBA carts.
#2641 - tepples - Sun Feb 09, 2003 10:58 pm
| ampz wrote: |
| No, the Sega vs Accolade precedent did not involve the SEGA logotype beeing stored in the game itself. |
Really? In the Sega v. Accolade opinion,
| Judge Reinhardt wrote: |
| The most recent version of the Genesis console, the "Genesis III", incorporates the licensed TMSS. When a game cartridge is inserted, the microprocessor contained in the Genesis III searches the game program for four bytes of data consisting of the letters "S-E-G-A" (the "TMSS initialization code"). If the Genesis III finds the TMSS initialization code in the right location, the game is rendered compatible and will operate on the console. In such case, the TMSS initialization code then prompts a visual display for approximately three seconds which reads "PRODUCED BY OR UNDER LICENSE FROM SEGA ENTERPRISES LTD" (the "Sega Message"). All of Sega's game cartridges, including those disassembled by Accolade, contain the TMSS initialization code. |
Yes, the Sega name was stored in the Genesis carts. I'm guessing that whether the particular representation of the console maker's name fits in 4 bytes (on the Genesis) or 156 (on the GBA) wouldn't matter according to Judge Reinhardt's analysis.
| ampz wrote: |
| Also, Nintendo has got hundreds of strange patents in the US, at least a few of them probably cover GBA carts. |
Patents are useless in the face of prior art. The GBA cart edge interface uses multiplexed address and data signals, but so do ATA, CompactFlash, and Intellivision.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#2644 - Music Is Math - Mon Feb 10, 2003 12:29 am
Honestly i just showed up a few days ago here at the forum, So please forgive me if I make a few "dumb" comments. Is it just the 156 bytes, no custom memory manager chips etc? I built my own nes deevelopment system back in the grey box days and after seeing what nintendo was doing to some folks (tengen) & the strong arm tactics concerning display space I gave up before finishing any thing. Now its 03 (instead of 89) and at least i can go do my own thing without having to pay 10k or wire up battery backed carts on my own. Anyone have any more info on legal ramifications of developing (and trying to sell) non nintendo gba carts?
Ian
#2646 - tepples - Mon Feb 10, 2003 12:46 am
| Music Is Math wrote: |
| I built my own nes deevelopment system back in the grey box days and after seeing what nintendo was doing to some folks (tengen) & the strong arm tactics concerning display space I gave up before finishing any thing. |
Atari Games v. Nintendo (Tengen was an Atari Games brand) was different from Sega v. Accolade primarily in the fact that Atari Games defrauded the Copyright Office when asking for the source code for the "10NES" lockout chip program.
| Quote: |
| Anyone have any more info on legal ramifications of developing (and trying to sell) non nintendo gba carts? |
Even after Lik Sang removed the flash carts under pressure from Nintendo, several accessories that connected to the GBA's Game Pak port remained in Lik Sang's catalog, such as a camera, a TV tuner, a digital audio recorder, etc. I find this encouraging.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#2648 - barnabe9999 - Mon Feb 10, 2003 12:50 am
But, if anyone can produce a cart...does anybody here know some Internet address or mail or physical address to contact them.
And does anybody know how much would cost to produce 5000 carts?
Thanks
#2649 - Music Is Math - Mon Feb 10, 2003 12:54 am
| tepples wrote: |
| Atari Games v. Nintendo (Tengen was an Atari Games brand) was different from Sega v. Accolade primarily in the fact that Atari Games defrauded the Copyright Office when asking for the source code for the "10NES" lockout chip program. |
Thanks tepples I've wondered all this time where that went. I'm sorrta hoping the xtrafun thing gets going eventually, but I sure don't want to have anyone being a single point of failure gateway for things that i develop.
I'm thinking about asking where I work if we could tackle the gba network thing :) Can we get the tiny gba in US yet?
#2651 - Music Is Math - Mon Feb 10, 2003 1:05 am
| tepples wrote: |
| Even after Lik Sang removed the flash carts under pressure from Nintendo, several accessories that connected to the GBA's Game Pak port remained in Lik Sang's catalog, such as a camera, a TV tuner, a digital audio recorder, etc. I find this encouraging. |
Whoops I missed that one. Last time I was looking into this getting a flash cart was no big are they still availible? makes me wonder where xtrtafun is with (or not with) nintendo legal wise...
Wouldn't be much fun to develop games and only look at them on PC and those gba carts have all that surface mount stuff (my pokemon ruby cart broke after 5 minutes with the kids and i don't know what to do with it ... I don't have a surface mount soldering station at home)
#2680 - ampz - Mon Feb 10, 2003 7:04 pm
You don't need any special soldering station for surface mount electronics. However, you do need some practice.
There are several companies producing flash carts.
#2689 - Music Is Math - Mon Feb 10, 2003 9:23 pm
i stopped working as a tech back in 87... i have trouble even seeing the traces... (on the gba carts).
#2693 - ampz - Mon Feb 10, 2003 11:11 pm
Magnification helps.
#2695 - ampz - Mon Feb 10, 2003 11:32 pm
Magnification helps
#4271 - yann_p - Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:01 am
Are there any PCB details of 32MByte etc carts out there with battery backed memory?
#4275 - ampz - Wed Mar 26, 2003 12:26 pm
Why would you want that?
#4277 - yann_p - Wed Mar 26, 2003 12:41 pm
I would like to make my own ... it's a lot cheaper than buying them ready built. I have seen the stuff on your page and therefore know you are working on one - have you solved the save corruption problems? Are you planning on releasing designs publically?
#4283 - ampz - Wed Mar 26, 2003 3:51 pm
I was woundering why you want battery backed SRAM?
#4285 - yann_p - Wed Mar 26, 2003 4:09 pm
I'm working on a game at the moment, using a windows emulator. I want to make a cartridge that I can easily program to test my code and a GBA, and that is as close to a proper cartridge as possible. I also want to spend as little money as possible :)
#4297 - tepples - Wed Mar 26, 2003 7:05 pm
| yann_p wrote: |
| I also want to spend as little money as possible :) |
If you just want to test (not distribute) GBA programs, then after factoring in parts and labor, it may be cheapest just to buy one of the mass-produced flash carts available at gbax.com.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#4302 - ampz - Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:18 pm
I can never understand why ppl think building their own hardware is cheaper than buying hardware that is mass produced in the far east.
A hint: It is not!