#81045 - Schultz - Wed Apr 26, 2006 9:56 pm
Recently have I developed a method to make really nice images for the Game Boy Advance in ANY resolutions consuming NO EXTRA MEMORY on game pak.
To that method I shall input the name "Images of Schultz".
For instance, a 256x256 image created with this method shall consume the very same amount of memory that a 1024x1024 or even a n x m image consumes: LESS THAN A 8x8 16 COLOUR TILE. (approximately 4 to 64 bytes ).
I would send one of those images as well as the complex algorithm. Nevertheless, one image of those formatted as a bitmap would consume decades of my internet effort and I do not really know how to post programs in this forum.
I shall, then, ask how should I post programs in the forum.
There is a negative side, nevertheless. To generate an image of those, the CPU must work for quite a time, but not much actually, perhaps 2 frames or less. (Although I have not tested it yet on a GBA)
It is getting late, and I must return home. In spite of that, I shall send the algorithm tomorrow perhaps.
If one saw the images and the algorithm, one would see how beautiful mathematics really is.
#81050 - phantom-inker - Wed Apr 26, 2006 10:31 pm
Edit: I had a reply here, but without more details, this post really isn't worth a reply. Personally, I think you're trolling, and I'll leave it at that.
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#81054 - FluBBa - Wed Apr 26, 2006 10:43 pm
| Schultz wrote: |
| I developed a method to make really nice images for the Game Boy Advance. |
Like yeah, whatever.
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#81057 - tepples - Wed Apr 26, 2006 10:58 pm
| Schultz wrote: |
Recently have I developed a method to make really nice images for the Game Boy Advance in ANY resolutions consuming NO EXTRA MEMORY on game pak.
To that method I shall input the name "Images of Schultz".
For instance, a 256x256 image created with this method shall consume the very same amount of memory that a 1024x1024 or even a n x m image consumes: LESS THAN A 8x8 16 COLOUR TILE. (approximately 4 to 64 bytes ). |
Let me guess: vector graphics. Someone brought up a rectangle-based image format over on the nesdev board.
| Quote: |
| I shall, then, ask how should I post programs in the forum. |
To post a snippet of code, enclose it in [code] ... [/code] tags, like this:
| Code: |
#include <stdio.h>
int main(void) {
puts("hello world");
}
|
Or you can post it on any of several free web hosts and post a link here.
| Quote: |
| There is a negative side, nevertheless. To generate an image of those, the CPU must work for quite a time, but not much actually, perhaps 2 frames or less. (Although I have not tested it yet on a GBA) |
Have you tested it on an emulator?
If this is for real (and not a late April Fools Day joke), I'm interested.
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#81060 - Dwedit - Wed Apr 26, 2006 11:08 pm
| FluBBa wrote: |
| Schultz wrote: | | I developed a method to make really nice images for the Game Boy Advance. |
Like yeah, whatever. |
Dude, farbrausch had a whole 64k to work with! I've created games on highly memory-constrained platforms, and kept the size below 25k. Imagine what SMB1 would have been like if Nintendo had decided to keep the engine and expand its size to 64k... (and I don't mean SMB2J).
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#81146 - sgeos - Thu Apr 27, 2006 6:34 am
Make a demo. Sumit it. Then I'll take you seriously. Until then...
-Brendan
#81172 - FluBBa - Thu Apr 27, 2006 5:09 pm
| Dwedit wrote: |
| Dude, farbrausch had a whole 64k to work with!... |
I just meant that calculating "nice pictures" (eg. fractals, textures & maps)is not new at all. I assume he's is not talking about picture compression (in the sense of jpeg).
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#81203 - Schultz - Thu Apr 27, 2006 9:31 pm
I have seen that most of you did no actually believe I was for real. Well then.
I had an idea, may any of you send me your e-mail address so I shall send the pictures and a readme with its size in the GBA? Do not worry, I shall not send viruses.
The matter is that more than 200000 pictures in 16 bit colour mode could be held in a cartridge.
To make the method more clear, it is a precalculation of the colours indeed. It is not vectorial, as someone suggested, but it is really, really nice. I mean, not every picture may be compressed, but there are specific ones which, although highly complex, can be described in a simple and beautiful mathematical manner.
The effects are worth seeing. The source code I might send, but I have not yet implemented it for the GBA since for the next months I shall be very busy indeed.
In short, send me your electronic address and I shall send the pictures. It is really woth seeing.
MATHEMATICS IS PERFECT
#81207 - Dwedit - Thu Apr 27, 2006 9:36 pm
In other words, it's a fractal?
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#81210 - Schultz - Thu Apr 27, 2006 9:45 pm
It is not a real fractal. It is like a 3D graphic but instead of the heights of the curve, we have it planifyed and its height substituted by its colour. Anyway, send a e-mail and I shall show it.
The fractal is a mathematical projection of infinite patterns. Mine is similar, but i dissmisses the uncomfortable real numbers opereations. It is faster, then.
#81228 - sajiimori - Thu Apr 27, 2006 10:46 pm
Wow, procedural graphics. *yawn*
I take it you did not follow the link posted by FluBBa.
#81301 - sgeos - Fri Apr 28, 2006 4:54 am
| Schultz wrote: |
| I have seen that most of you did no actually believe I was for real. |
Without a demo a have to take your word for it. With a demo you have proof. Posting a demo puts you in a very strong position. Why settle for anything less?
-Brendan
#81306 - HyperHacker - Fri Apr 28, 2006 8:10 am
Yeah, I developed a method to display any 256x192 image without storing it at all: have the user draw it at runtime. :-p Seriously, there's plenty of free hosts you could put a demo on, and a few even don't suck (last I saw Geocities was good, though that was quite some time ago). I'd really rather not give some random person my email when they don't need it; I get enough spam as it is and I have no way to tell if you're just going to sign me up for some mailing list.
#81310 - sgeos - Fri Apr 28, 2006 8:42 am
Just submit it to gbadev.org. They take their time posting the demo, but otherwise I have not complaints.
-Brendan
#81320 - keldon - Fri Apr 28, 2006 10:12 am
And then there is brinkster.com aswell.
#81325 - wintermute - Fri Apr 28, 2006 12:01 pm
| Schultz wrote: |
It is not a real fractal. It is like a 3D graphic but instead of the heights of the curve, we have it planifyed and its height substituted by its colour. Anyway, send a e-mail and I shall show it.
The fractal is a mathematical projection of infinite patterns. Mine is similar, but i dissmisses the uncomfortable real numbers opereations. It is faster, then. |
You mean wavelet compression?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wavelet_compression
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#81330 - Mighty Max - Fri Apr 28, 2006 1:02 pm
| Quote: |
| For instance, a 256x256 image created with this method shall consume the very same amount of memory that a 1024x1024 or even a n x m image consumes: LESS THAN A 8x8 16 COLOUR TILE. (approximately 4 to 64 bytes ). |
You know that there is a proven maximum rate on lossless compression algorithms?
if you take the best random permutation of a 256x256 image with 16bit color, where each color appears exactly once, there is no chance of reducing the the bits/symbol.
I mean i'd really like to see such algorithm, but i don't see a chance.
I highly doubt that the en&decoded image at these compression rates (3MB [1024*1024*RGB]=>64Bytes) has much in common with the original image. The loss is much too massive.
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#81675 - sgeos - Mon May 01, 2006 3:03 am
| Mighty Max wrote: |
| if you take the best random permutation of a 256x256 image with 16bit color, where each color appears exactly once, there is no chance of reducing the the bits/symbol. |
If random, yes. If pseudo-random, then you could compact it to a few seeds and other RNG variables... 16 bytes? Then again, what are chances? =)
-Brendan Sechter
#81692 - keldon - Mon May 01, 2006 11:07 am
Well lets just see the method, we might be shocked when we see it.
#81710 - Ultima2876 - Mon May 01, 2006 5:04 pm
If he had such a compression scheme, surely he wouldn't be showing it to a bunch of GBA developers, and would be making millions selling it.
#81745 - tepples - Mon May 01, 2006 9:05 pm
I'm guessing it's some sort of procedural synthesis that's useful for some types of textures but not for others. I can see how a formula for a texture might be encoded into 16 to 64 bytes.
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-- Who?
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-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#81771 - SevenString - Mon May 01, 2006 11:44 pm
| Code: |
for(py = 0; py < y_res; py++)
{
for(px = 0; px < x_res; px++)
{
x = x0 = px;
y = y0 = py;
x2 = x * x;
y2 = y * y
iter = 0;
max_iter = 1000;
while((x2 + y2) < (4) && (iter < max_iter))
{
y = 2 * x * y + y0;
x = x2 - y2 + x0;
x2 = x * x;
y2 = y * y;
iter++;
}
if(iter == max_iter)
{
color = 0;
}
else
{
color = iter;
}
}
}
|
I like this procedural texture ;)
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#81787 - Dwedit - Tue May 02, 2006 4:13 am
Care to graph it?
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#81790 - sajiimori - Tue May 02, 2006 4:20 am
#81831 - chishm - Tue May 02, 2006 11:39 am
After reading that article, I got a little suspicious about it's correctness, and the date of publication doesn't help. Is this true or just a well written and researched April Fool's joke?
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#81834 - keldon - Tue May 02, 2006 11:59 am
Well you can always check up on the references.
#81923 - MaHe - Tue May 02, 2006 8:50 pm
Very simple: send the pictures to gbadev@spambob.com
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#81948 - keldon - Tue May 02, 2006 10:48 pm
Pictures do not work for the spambob.com addresses, you'll need to do a spambob.net forward
#83151 - Vegetable - Sat May 13, 2006 1:53 pm
Why the hell are you guys being such dicks about this? Stop stroking your egos.
Especially you, Flubba.
#83174 - thegamefreak0134 - Sat May 13, 2006 6:51 pm
Hello vegetable, and welcome. (1) It's our purpose of being to analyze problems like this, and (2) You'll want to watch your language if you want to make more than 1 post. Welcome to the formus!
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#83180 - sajiimori - Sat May 13, 2006 9:54 pm
Vegetable, some folks like to be nice to everyone, and that's cool. Other folks are inclined to slap arrogant people in the head. One might say that it's equally arrogant to slap someone that way, and that's probably true at least some of the time. You're free to use your best judgement.
#83186 - Ant6n - Sat May 13, 2006 11:50 pm
| sajiimori wrote: |
| Vegetable, some folks like to be nice to everyone, and that's cool. Other folks are inclined to slap arrogant people in the head. One might say that it's equally arrogant to slap someone that way, and that's probably true at least some of the time. You're free to use your best judgement. |
my judgement is that there is a generally unfriendly vibe in the forums due to some folks that think they are all that and like to bash newcomers
#83199 - Dwedit - Sun May 14, 2006 2:10 am
Until I see anything, this is all vaporware.
_________________
"We are merely sprites that dance at the beck and call of our button pressing overlord."
#83200 - sajiimori - Sun May 14, 2006 2:20 am
Ant6n, your impression concerned me a bit because I've always found this forum to be very friendly to newcomers.
Because I had nothing better to do, though, I skimmed the last month worth of posts in the Beginner's section. I was hoping to find no more than a couple mildly condescending posts.
The number I found was zero. Are you sure it's not just this one person that is getting a negative reaction (and for good reason, I think)?
#83205 - Natso - Sun May 14, 2006 2:39 am
1. I must agree with Dwedit and I think it is perfectly reasonable for us to believe that this is a scam, as no evidence of its true existence exists. Though it may exist, without any proof it is as good as non-existant. Also, we have no reason to believe that a compression this powerful can exist, and this basically decides that this is a scam.
2. I don't think we need to be mean to the guy, but let him know that we want something that does something and that a lot of great and awesome words, are basically just a lot of wasted words if they have no support.
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#83290 - sgeos - Mon May 15, 2006 1:09 am
I don't think he's coming back. Look at the date of the first post and his number of total posts.
-Brendan
#83299 - tepples - Mon May 15, 2006 4:51 am
It's most likely some form of procedural synthesis as seen in .the .product (64 KB demo) and .kkrieger (96 KB game). Can we leave it at that for now?
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-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.
#83337 - Vegetable - Mon May 15, 2006 6:53 pm
| thegamefreak0134 wrote: |
| Hello vegetable, and welcome. (1) It's our purpose of being to analyze problems like this, and (2) You'll want to watch your language if you want to make more than 1 post. Welcome to the formus! |
So it's your job to run anyone with an idea into the ground?
Don't be so callous.
#83341 - kusma - Mon May 15, 2006 7:04 pm
quit sock puppeting.
#83342 - tepples - Mon May 15, 2006 7:06 pm
If an idea seems to violate Shannon's laws of information, and the poster hasn't given a reason why the method would not violate Shannon, then the poster making the claims needs to post more details instead of holding all of us in suspense. Until Schultz (the original poster) replies with details, the only method that we know of that fits a big texture into 64 bytes and doesn't violate Shannon is procedural synthesis.
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-- Who?
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Last edited by tepples on Mon May 15, 2006 7:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
#83343 - Vegetable - Mon May 15, 2006 7:07 pm
| kusma wrote: |
| quit sock puppeting. |
You're being immature.
#83369 - sajiimori - Mon May 15, 2006 10:47 pm
And you're inventing an issue where there is none. Let it go.
#83387 - Dwedit - Tue May 16, 2006 1:55 am
I think this thread needs the flames pruned off of it...
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#83408 - tepples - Tue May 16, 2006 4:48 am
Consensus is that it's some form of procedural synthesis. Full stop.
Locked by request. If you disagree, please PM me. If you wish to discuss procedural synthesis, feel free to create a new topic.
_________________
-- Where is he?
-- Who?
-- You know, the human.
-- I think he moved to Tilwick.