#31610 - warsong - Mon Dec 13, 2004 1:15 am
I expected more from the compo entries.
The majority of the games are clones, use copy righted material, or are below standard in art and design. One person decided to make strip poker for kids which would be rated M which would cut out the majority of the consumers.
A picture is worth 1000 words and the games that stick out on art and some originality are
starfortress, ouzy, and spacewar,bsol
Another 3 seem are 1/2 decent but need more work. The games by themselves would not sell well, but selling them as a multi pack might have a chance. It is a good thing that the cartridge is being sold to break even or else there would be problems. If this does not sell well I still think there should be another one like this but with team efforts.
Aside form that the creativity and design is lacking. This is just an opinion. I commend them for getting something done unlike others.
#31612 - sajiimori - Mon Dec 13, 2004 1:59 am
Yay, negativity!
Which one was yours again?
#31613 - Krakken - Mon Dec 13, 2004 2:11 am
A picture DOESN'T speak a thousand words because although mine is a PacMan close, it doesn't state anything about it being a _multiplayer_ pacman game. I already have half my friends addicted to it and I think there will be a lot more twists to come with others too. These people are very good. You shouldn't judge a book by its cover.
#31626 - zazery - Mon Dec 13, 2004 5:06 am
From what I have seen, most of these entries look great. I would have to play them before I make any judgment. I know there are quite a few games that I know I would like to try. The quality looks great and I'd like to see some more screenshots since they won't be released for a while.
| Krakken wrote: |
| A picture DOESN'T speak a thousand words because although mine is a PacMan close, it doesn't state anything about it being a _multiplayer_ pacman game. I already have half my friends addicted to it and I think there will be a lot more twists to come with others too. These people are very good. You shouldn't judge a book by its cover. |
Multiplayer, that sounds like a lot of fun. I hope it's one of the ones included on the cart, I think it would be fun to play.
#31637 - blinky465 - Mon Dec 13, 2004 9:53 am
| warsong wrote: |
| If this does not sell well I still think there should be another one like this but with team efforts... |
How about it? Some of us (ok, me) were a bit late finding this forum in time to enter the compo and need help getting a finished product...
Are there any talented pixel artists out there - a few years ago, I was inundated with requests for help from sprite artists; it seems nowadays everyone wants to be a coder!
#31642 - Wriggler - Mon Dec 13, 2004 12:33 pm
I'm not sure how you can say you expected more, when you haven't even played them yet. Compared to the other competition entries I've seen from previous years, this one looks great! :)
Ben
#31651 - identitycrisisuk - Mon Dec 13, 2004 2:48 pm
Oooh, just noticed SSA64 - if it's "just" an Ikaruga clone I want to play it.
NOW!!!!
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#31658 - SimonB - Mon Dec 13, 2004 3:37 pm
| warsong wrote: |
| use copy righted material |
Please PM me if you find entries using copyrighted material.
Simon
#31659 - dj-ceejay - Mon Dec 13, 2004 3:48 pm
I would like to hear some more constructive crits. That's the only way we can get better. How would you have done things differently?
Regarding graphics - I personally like the restrictions the GBA imposes. Gameplay cannot be judged by just a screenshot.
Just because the games are going to be sold doesn't mean that you can demand professional (read expensive) quality. I am assuming all the entries are by part-timers.
Perhaps given a longer period of time graphics could have been more polished. We made the game, then 'fancified' the graphics.
Our game was GASP! btw.
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#31674 - Wriggler - Mon Dec 13, 2004 6:26 pm
| identitycrisisuk wrote: |
Oooh, just noticed SSA64 - if it's "just" an Ikaruga clone I want to play it.
NOW!!!! |
So is our entry: Switch... isn't it weird that two Ikaruga-type games were entered into the same competition?!? :) Haha, face-off of the rip-off games!
Ben
#31684 - cappeca - Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:32 pm
| warsong wrote: |
| One person decided to make strip poker for kids which would be rated M which would cut out the majority of the consumers. |
Hehehehehehe, thanks for noticing. It's not for kids, by the way - you'd know if you *played* it. In fact, you can put an R in there, or maybe XXX, which could attract even more consumers. For me, I'll let the actual judges decide if the game needs a few black stripes, a full art rework or will be cut right off.
Cesar
#31686 - warsong - Mon Dec 13, 2004 8:27 pm
Sajimori
More like constructive criticism.
Kraken
Couldn?t you have made another character? Good idea but I played a multiplayer pac-man before but as you said others might like it.
Zazery
Many games get sell for how they look which is why they are on display. Even in other competitions just by viewing the images show that the games are not that good ?most? of the times.
Blinky465
Plenty of people offering and asking for help. You could make a good game within a week or two with good art. I offered art assistance and many others have in this and other art sites like the pixilation forums.
Wiggler
That?s a matter of opinion, and I always expect more. If you like all the games them better for you. ;)
Cappeca
I was being sarcastic and know it was not meant for kids. You could have changed the art and put fantasy art for a background so kids and women would appreciate it more. I do not think your game would get in and maybe if you edit the art then maybe it will.
#31692 - identitycrisisuk - Mon Dec 13, 2004 11:12 pm
| Wriggler wrote: |
| identitycrisisuk wrote: | Oooh, just noticed SSA64 - if it's "just" an Ikaruga clone I want to play it.
NOW!!!! |
So is our entry: Switch... isn't it weird that two Ikaruga-type games were entered into the same competition?!? :) Haha, face-off of the rip-off games!
Ben |
Oh yeah, can see that now. it was just that SSA64 had the immediately recognisable look to the bullets and the screen was full of them. I shall reserve judgement on which is better until I play them though.
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#31759 - sgeos - Tue Dec 14, 2004 8:44 am
Have not played any entries but spacefortress, so I can't comment on them. The multiplayer pacman does sound neat.
-Brendan
#31794 - Quirky - Tue Dec 14, 2004 8:10 pm
| warsong wrote: |
| Plenty of people offering and asking for help. You could make a good game within a week or two with good art. I offered art assistance and many others have in this and other art sites like the pixilation forums. |
One thing is offering assistance, another is sitting down and doing the donkey work of drawing many quality frames and fonts and stuff. Most pixel artists that offer help just want to draw a few "cool backgrounds" and can't commit to much more. I don't know if you've ever worked on a game to completion, but it takes yonks to get anywhere. A week or two seems a very short while for a part time GBA project. Perhaps you are thinking of PC devving, where size doesn't matter and there are several poweful games creation languages.
Or maybe I'm just a slow coder who can't draw...
#31972 - JL - Thu Dec 16, 2004 10:17 am
Actually, is it allowed for us (compo-entry-dudes) to post more screenshots of our games?
This could also help out filtering the copy-righted material (if any)...
Grtz,
JL
#32437 - Jagos - Wed Dec 22, 2004 9:52 pm
Seeing the game selections sketches the judges had done, I really think they're crazy.
#32442 - helava - Wed Dec 22, 2004 10:26 pm
| Jagos wrote: |
| Seeing the game selections sketches the judges had done, I really think they're crazy. |
If I'm interpreting this correctly, you're saying they're crazy for how they've picked the games thus far? Based on them having played the game, and you seeing a single screen of each?
Seriously?
seppo
#32444 - Jagos - Wed Dec 22, 2004 10:56 pm
That's it, as a potential purchaser of the game which I would buy before playing it. Seeing the captures I really think that a game like "Smiley's run" is a lot cooler than all that cards and puzzle games that are gonna be in the cart.
Have you seen "Star Fortress Dendron"?, it has an incredible professional look. Maybe it's short (like mine's) but we're speaking of fun and (this is my subjective opinion) cards/puzzle games are BORING.
Other games like ouzy being out in favour of the selected games is a thing that I cannot understand.
#32447 - SimonB - Thu Dec 23, 2004 12:17 am
| Jagos wrote: |
| Seeing the captures I really think that a game like "Smiley's run" is a lot cooler than all that cards and puzzle games that are gonna be in the cart. |
What? No games have been selected to be on the cart yet. As it says on the compo website, the games marked with: "YES" = Has a good chance on getting on the cart
There are also 3 games that was very close and would be on the cartridge if they fixed some things. In your case it was the lenght of the game. I have already suggested to you to add a few more levels since it takes 5 minutes to complete the game, and since there is no real replay-value we would rather fit a few smaller games on the cart instead. Games that you can play for a longer period of time.
| Jagos wrote: |
| Have you seen "Star Fortress Dendron"?, it has an incredible professional look. |
We have seen it and as far as we know the developers are still working on the game and will submit an updated version. If they do they have a very good chance of getting on the cart as all the judges really liked the game.
The third game marked with "YES/MAYBE" was GunKid, and we have already received a new version that is said to have fixed the scrolling problems. I have not had a chance to test it yet but if it works then it will most definitely be marked as a "YES" entry.
Several of the games marked with "MAYBE" also still has a good chance if they address some issues, like bugs or lack of sound.
| Jagos wrote: |
| Other games like ouzy being out in favour of the selected games is a thing that I cannot understand. |
Sure the game is good but I finished it in <1 minute, and considering the game is already 500Kbyte we did not want to include it in the cart. I think its strange that you cannot understand why a game that takes a minute to complete is not selected to be on the cart.
After January 5th when we have re-reviewed the updated games, we will have to decide which of the games marked with "YES" will be put on the cart. Of course not all of them will fit so we will have to weigh the pro's and con's like lastability and size againts eachother to be able to fit the most amount of good games on the finalized cartridge.
Simon
#32449 - Jagos - Thu Dec 23, 2004 12:34 am
A great game that could be finished in <1 minute worth more than some type of games than doesn't worth even a first play. And you said some time ago on the compo thread that you wanted little games that could be finished in a few minutes, not as long as commercial ones.
#32451 - SimonB - Thu Dec 23, 2004 12:55 am
| Jagos wrote: |
| A great game that could be finished in <1 minute worth more than some type of games than doesn't worth even a first play. |
Oh really. You mentioned the puzzle games, the card games and the basketball game. Any other games? These arent worth even testing 1 time? Ok...
| Jagos wrote: |
| And you said some time ago on the compo thread that you wanted little games that could be finished in a few minutes, not as long as commercial ones. |
I did? When and where did I do that? I do however remember saying "nice and small games that you can pick up at any time and play for a few mins". Of course what is meant by that is that you can pick it up at any time and play it for a few minutes then stop...and then play again for a few minutes later etc. I havent said that you should be able to finish the games in a few minutes. How much fun would it be with a cartridge with 7 games that each take a few minutes to finish? Playing a game for 5 minutes and finishing a game in 5 minutes are two very different things.
Simon
#32456 - keldon - Thu Dec 23, 2004 1:25 am
That would be quite funny (in a bad way) if the cartridge was released with 7 games that you could complete in a minute. We would be the industry's laughing stock. We could never live it down.
#32459 - tepples - Thu Dec 23, 2004 1:56 am
What about 204 games you can complete in 6 seconds each?
(end "WarioWare is short" rant)
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#32492 - helava - Thu Dec 23, 2004 10:09 am
204 6 second games? Not necessarily worth it. A game that puts those 204 games into a framework where the core content of the game is learning how to play each of those games so that you can *win* each of them in 6 seconds - now you've got a game going.
seppo
#32499 - sgeos - Thu Dec 23, 2004 12:28 pm
| tepples wrote: |
| What about 204 games you can complete in 6 seconds each? |
204 * 6 / 60 = 20.4 minutes of gameplay. I can't imagine that all of those games have only 6 seconds worth of interest.
-Brendan
#32501 - dj-ceejay - Thu Dec 23, 2004 12:48 pm
Wario Ware comes to mind - they were only 5 second games and lots of them. That is a great game.
Our puzzle game (GASP!) cannot be completed, it just goes on forever. You can also dip in and out - an attractive idea for portable gaming.
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#32506 - Krakken - Thu Dec 23, 2004 2:38 pm
Just so you know, I don't intend to add 1, 2 and 3 player support for KrakkMan. It kinda imbalances the game and defeats the point. I'll fix a couple of bugs before Simon goes to release it on GBA Dev though. :)
#32510 - sgeos - Thu Dec 23, 2004 2:55 pm
| Krakken wrote: |
| Just so you know, I don't intend to add 1, 2 and 3 player support for KrakkMan. It kinda imbalances the game and defeats the point. I'll fix a couple of bugs before Simon goes to release it on GBA Dev though. :) |
Four player only?! That sounds kind of limiting. Imbalanced or not, there is no way in the spirit world I'll be able to round up 3 other people with GBAs.
-Brendan
#32513 - Wriggler - Thu Dec 23, 2004 3:13 pm
Yeah I can just about muster two, but four with flash cards is near to impossible. How about 2 player support with 2 AI?
Ben
#32601 - sgeos - Fri Dec 24, 2004 7:23 am
| Wriggler wrote: |
| Yeah I can just about muster two, but four with flash cards is near to impossible. How about 2 player support with 2 AI? |
He may not have the time to make AI. Even if it is only 2P or 3P on the the map, anything is better than nothing.
Of course, this is the developer's call. =)
-Brendan
#32602 - Krakken - Fri Dec 24, 2004 8:14 am
AI was a possibility but I don't know... I just don't think it would be as much fun but I will consider it.
The game multiboots to all other GBAs, you only need one cart 4 GBA units and a link cable.
2P and 3P works and maybe I could add a few perks like increased speed for the ghost or being able to see PacMan's position on the radar when there are not 4 players. I wish I could show you guys and get your suggestions.
#32613 - Vince - Fri Dec 24, 2004 11:22 am
Hi,
Do not rush yourself into adding last-minutes features. Your game seems great and I hope it's gonna be on the cart.
There will be time to add new features once the game is released on gbadev.
Just my 2 cents,
Vince
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#32636 - sgeos - Fri Dec 24, 2004 12:52 pm
| Krakken wrote: |
| AI was a possibility but I don't know... I just don't think it would be as much fun but I will consider it. |
With multiplayer games, it's always the more the merrier. Less than 4P may not be as much fun, but "not as much fun" is better than not being able to play it at all. My chances of being able to play a 4P GBA games are between slim and nil- closer to nil.
-Brendan
#32637 - Krakken - Fri Dec 24, 2004 12:57 pm
Thanks Vince. I don't believe it'll get on the cart because it's in the MAYBE category due to the fact that it's 4 players only. I'll get it fixed up and possibly allow 3 players. It will be released on GBA Dev and anyone with a flash cart, 3 friends with GBAs and a 4-way link cable can then play.
The reason I have chosen this is because of the way the game was designed - it just works in such a way that 3 player and 2 player just wouldn't work as the game is intended. You'll understand when it's released. I think it will work out better for everyone if it's free to download anyway although now my friends will have to buy a flash cart if they want their own copy - or they can just come to me. :)
When it's released I can hopefully get some feedback and then I can fix it all up in whatever ways that you feel necessary.
#32691 - Jagos - Sat Dec 25, 2004 2:08 am
| SimonB wrote: |
| I do however remember saying "nice and small games that you can pick up at any time and play for a few mins". Of course what is meant by that is that you can pick it up at any time and play it for a few minutes then stop...and then play again for a few minutes later etc. I havent said that you should be able to finish the games in a few minutes. How much fun would it be with a cartridge with 7 games that each take a few minutes to finish? Playing a game for 5 minutes and finishing a game in 5 minutes are two very different things. |
You can take any videogame you want and play for a few minutes and then stop. Since that requirement is something superfluous I understood your phrase as the other meaning.
#32713 - tepples - Sat Dec 25, 2004 5:33 am
| Jagos wrote: |
| You can take any videogame you want and play for a few minutes and then stop. |
Five minutes won't even get you between save points in most RPGs, let alone through the opening cut scene, which has climbed past the 1 hour mark in many PS2 RPGs.
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-- Who?
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