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Graphics > Coder art?

#158624 - Lazy1 - Sun Jun 15, 2008 1:51 am

Anyone else get that feeling when drawing something that no matter how much you work on it the end result will never be what you imagined?
I'm supposed to be drawing a vending machine but now it kinda looks like one of those computers from the 50s.

#158625 - silent_code - Sun Jun 15, 2008 2:20 am

<LOL>
Show, show! Please! :^D
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July 5th 08: "Volumetric Shadow Demo" 1.6.0 (final) source released
June 5th 08: "Zombie NDS" WIP released!
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#158627 - Lazy1 - Sun Jun 15, 2008 2:23 am

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9918/ohgodwhysc9.png

I can see the rest of the graphics are going to be fun to work on...

#158629 - tepples - Sun Jun 15, 2008 2:29 am

I assume it's supposed to be viewed straight-on. Are you trying to draw a candy vending machine or a soda vending machine? How big (in pixels) is a metre in your game?


(puts on his mod hat)
[Doesn't look that off-topic to me. Moved to Graphics. --MOD]
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#158632 - Lazy1 - Sun Jun 15, 2008 3:43 am

I thought it was off topic since I'm not asking for help but starting a discussion on coder art.
Either way, you raise some interesting points that are making me reconsider the style of my idea.

Top-down: Easiest, very little detail.
Side scrolling: Harder to draw, more detail and much better looking*
Isometric: Probably way out of my league

*As far as my coder art can take it

#158635 - silent_code - Sun Jun 15, 2008 10:44 am

Did you try to building things with simple shapes in 3D? Sometimes that helps to get a "usable" look and it's not that hard to do, once you make yourself familiar with a software package. I hear blender is quite easy, but I use an old version of Cinema4D.
But then, I do have some basic art skills, that let me do what I want most of the time... so I may be biased. ;^D
_________________
July 5th 08: "Volumetric Shadow Demo" 1.6.0 (final) source released
June 5th 08: "Zombie NDS" WIP released!
It's all on my page, just click WWW below.

#158636 - silent_code - Sun Jun 15, 2008 11:06 am

Hope it helps: 15min. of "work" (this is my coder art) resulted in the following image: [Images not permitted - Click here to view it]
I will PM you a link to the Photoshop 6 file, if you like to, so you can check it out in more "detail" - it's still 22 x 32 - and hopefully learn from it. :^)

It's 32 colors, but you can easily reduce it to 16 colors without big changes in the image.

Btw: I believe, that if you are very good at one thing, most other things you won't be able to master, without totally neglecting the single thing you are good at. So, it's no loss, if you aren't exactly an artist, as long as you are a good programmer. :^)

EDIT: Oh, did I mention, that you can use the image I posted freely, without any charge? (Would be nice to tell me you did, though! ;^D )
_________________
July 5th 08: "Volumetric Shadow Demo" 1.6.0 (final) source released
June 5th 08: "Zombie NDS" WIP released!
It's all on my page, just click WWW below.

Last edited by silent_code on Sat Jun 28, 2008 6:13 pm; edited 2 times in total

#158647 - sgeos - Sun Jun 15, 2008 7:12 pm

silent_code wrote:
Btw: I believe, that if you are very good at one thing, most other things you won't be able to master, without totally neglecting the single thing you are good at. So, it's no loss, if you aren't exactly an artist, as long as you are a good programmer. :^)

You can only put your time so many places. My theory is that you can only become super good at one thing in your life, and it will take your whole life. You could also become very good at a few things, etc.

Try sketching on paper for a while before hitting the pixels.

-Brendan

#158680 - gauauu - Mon Jun 16, 2008 2:49 pm

I had a lot of luck with using ugly programmer-drawn sprites and free internet resources for a demo of my game, which attracted an artist who made it look good in the end.

My point being: if you're the programmer, make the game fun before worrying TOO much about whether your graphics are ugly.

#158707 - keldon - Mon Jun 16, 2008 6:27 pm

True, although you would be surprised how much better a game 'feels' with appropriate graphics. Our brains associate look to feel so much that a new appearance can make some people feel like they are playing a different game!

#158825 - Lazy1 - Wed Jun 18, 2008 9:45 pm

Since I'm working on a competition entry I cannot ask for outside help which means my coder art will be the final product :D
That being said I'm hoping the gameplay will be good enough that people can see beyond poorly drawn graphics.

My main problem is drawing curves, can they be well done in an 8x8 square or should I be drawing 16x16 tiles?

#158826 - DekuTree64 - Wed Jun 18, 2008 10:30 pm

Yeah, for general repeating patterns like grass and dirt, 8x8 will probably never look good. You can use a bunch of 8x8 tiles to get the same effect as larger tiles though. I like 16x16 as the general size for things on GBA/DS size screens, or if you want more space for a body on characters they can be 16x24 or 16x32.

And coders can be artists too, but it does take the same kind of love for the craft as writing code. Otherwise it's probably not worth the amount of time it takes to get good. As sgeos said, you can't be the best at everything. But for someone like me, having many skills up to a fairly high level is better than being the best in the world at one thing.

Curves in pixel art are tricky, but since you have so few possible arrangements of pixels to begin with, it's not too tough to brute-force find what looks best :)
Usually 2 or 3 shades of each color works best for me, so I can do a bit of manual anti-aliasing to give the illusion of smoother curves.
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#158840 - sgeos - Thu Jun 19, 2008 3:31 am

DekuTree64 wrote:
And coders can be artists too, but it does take the same kind of love for the craft as writing code. Otherwise it's probably not worth the amount of time it takes to get good.

Anyone can train talent, but in general only people with a passion for the craft bother to do so.

Lazy1 wrote:
Since I'm working on a competition entry I cannot ask for outside help which means my coder art will be the final product :D
That being said I'm hoping the gameplay will be good enough that people can see beyond poorly drawn graphics.

You do not need good art for something to be captivating. My friend started a webcomic with really bad stick figures. Now he is on volume 360 and the stick figures are pretty good, although the art is still worse than most of the other webcomics I have looked at.

Lazy1 wrote:
My main problem is drawing curves, can they be well done in an 8x8 square or should I be drawing 16x16 tiles?

Circle tool. Bezier curve tool.

-Brendan